The Summer of Civil Rights
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| The summer of 1963 |
President John F. Kennedy, 11 June 1963
1963 is the first full year of my life that I retain a relatively clear memory of; a bit less dreamlike and faded than the previous years. I turned five on August 16th - in Dayton, Ohio of all places. I spent that entire summer there, living with my uncle and aunt, Bill and Sheila Clements. Uncle Bill taught me how to hit a baseball on that day. Bill Clements would become a respected investigative journalist for the Chicago Daily News and, later, the Sun Times. It was his reporting that sent Illinois governor Otto Kerner to prison. He died unexpectedly in August of 1983 at age fifty. I miss him more than I can even express. To say that he had a big influence on my life would be an understatement.
In 1963 I was still too young to appreciate what a monumental year I was living through. The only two news events I can clearly recall are the death of Pope John XXIII in June - and of course - the horrible tragedy that occurred on November 22. And although I have a vague recollection of all the people gathered at the Lincoln Memorial in August, the civil rights saga pretty much went over my head. About the only thing of any cultural significance I was thinking about in that moment of time was Peter, Paul and Mary's recording of Puff the Magic Dragon, which I loved. Ignorance is bliss as they say. During that long ago summer of 1963 I was as blissful as a froggy on a lily pad.
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| Degan back in the day |
2013 is a year that is filled to the rafters with half-century milestones. There is no getting away from the fact that 1963 was a year that changed this country forever, in ways good and bad.
On June the 11th Jack Kennedy went before a nationwide television audience to confront the moral issue of equal rights for all Americans. On that day, two "negro" kids, Vivian Malone and James Hood, were escorted onto the campus of the University of Alabama by the National Guard. To score a few cheap political points, Governor George Wallace had earlier stood in the doorway of the school, threatening to block their entrance. That was all Deputy Attorney General, Nicholas Katzenbach, needed to hear. In an exasperated but calm voice, he read Wallace the riot act. The District Court - of Alabama, Buster! - had ordered that these two students be admitted. That order was going to be obeyed - whether the governor liked it or not, ya heah?.
George Wallace blinked.
On that very night, shortly after JFK addressed the nation, Medgar Evers, the Field Representative for the NAACP in Mississippi, was shot and killed in an ambush outside of his home. It was that kind of time in America, with events rushing by at the speed of light, or at least that's how it seems in hindsight. Before the summer was over (and less than three weeks after the March on Washington) a black church in Birmingham was bombed by a group of racist bastards who actually believed they were performing some kind of heroic deed. Four little girls were blown to smithereens by these "heroes". Sadly, their names have been forgotten over the course of fifty years. Their martyrdom was more responsible than anything for the passage the following June of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Let us bow our heads, tip our hats and raise our glasses in loving memory of these four little gals. It may be a bit of a stretch to attempt all three of these things simultaneously, but what the heck, let's at least give it the old college try, ay?
Addie Mae Collins (age 14)
Denise McNair (age 11)
Carole Robertson (age 14)
Cynthia Wesley (age 14)
At the time, only one of the four people responsible for this atrocity was brought to justice. He was fined $100 and received a six month sentence for the possession of dynamite - I'm not kidding. In 1977 he would be retried and sent to prison where he died. Two others were eventually put on trial in 2000 and convicted of murder. Only one of the four escaped justice by conveniently dying. C'est la vie. None of their names are worthy of mention.
Oh, I wish I was in Dixie
Oy vey! Oy vey!
It was easy to believe, as the twenty-first century dawned, that the mindset that produced this type of horror was behind us. True, we did elect our first African American president in 2008 - but the reaction of a whole lot of people who did not vote for him - particularly in the South and the Midwest - has been "instructive" (to say the least). The other important piece of historic legislation that came out of the nineteen-sixties was the Voting Rights Act of 1965, which guaranteed that no one would be denied the right to cast his or her precious ballot simply because of the color of their skin. The election of the first black guy to the presidency has so freaked out the racists in Dear ol' Dixie, many of them are seeking the repeal of that law. "We'll be good this time", they're saying, "Trust us".
It would seem to me that Jim Crow is hellbent on taking his weird act on a national comeback tour. That is precisely what those proposed "Voter ID Laws" were all about. The GOP has been taken over by the ideological heirs of the racist Dixiecrats of yore - and has been corrupted beyond redemption in the process. The "party of Abraham Lincoln" has devolved into the party of Uncle Fester. They know goddamned well that it has become politically impossible for them to win office on the national level. They need to deny the ballot to as many people as possible - starting with black people. Nowadays the success of the Republicans depends upon the suppression of votes. Think about that.
PREDICTION:
Unless those voter ID laws are successfully implemented between now and then, a Democratic administration will succeed another Democratic administration on Inauguration Day 2017. Do you know when the last time that happened? When Franklin Pierce handed over the reigns of power to stuffy old James Buchanan on March 4, 1857. It hasn't happened since - check the history books. And it might very well be that the first black president bequeaths the office to the first woman president. The juiciest irony of all is that most of the Democrats of 1857 were ingrained racists and (it goes without saying) sexist. Had they known of this possibility they would have disbanded the party then and there. Life is funny that way, you know?
"Now is the time to rise from the dark and desolate valley of segregation to the sunlit path of racial justice. Now is the time to open the doors of opportunity to all of God's children. Now is the time to lift our nation from the quicksands of racial injustice to the solid rock of brotherhood."
Martin Luther King, 28 August 1963
1963 still resonates across the decades in every respect - politically and culturally. By Thanksgiving there was a new guy sitting in the Oval Office: Lyndon Baines Johnson, a Texan who would do more for the cause of Civil Rights than any president since Lincoln. LBJ was astute enough to understand that freedom was on the march and there would be no stopping it, baby! The racists might just as well have tried to stop the sun from rising in the eastern sky. On New Year's Eve a previously obscure rock 'n' roll band from England called the Beatles would be the biggest thing on the American charts. You say you want a revolution? So much had changed in America since New Year's Day.
George Wallace, Nick Katzenbach, Vivian Malone and James Hood are all gone now. Five months and eleven days after he reached out to touch the conscience of a nation, Jack Kennedy went to Dallas. Four and-a-half years after that, Dr. King went to Memphis. Fifty years on, 1963 clings to the American soul. It lights the darkest American night. It won't let go. I hope it never does.
And we gazed upon the chimes of freedom flashing. Wasn't that a time?
Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
SUGGESTED READING
Parting the Waters: America in the King Years
by Taylor Branch
The best book I've ever read about the Civil Rights struggle in America (1955-1968) by a first rate historian.
SUGGESTED VIEWING:
President Kennedy's address to the American people on the subject of Civil Rights, 11 June 1963:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BEhKgoA86U
`
 |
| George 'n' Nick |
George Wallace blinked.
 |
| Medgar Evers |
 |
| Little Martyrs |
Denise McNair (age 11)
Carole Robertson (age 14)
Cynthia Wesley (age 14)
At the time, only one of the four people responsible for this atrocity was brought to justice. He was fined $100 and received a six month sentence for the possession of dynamite - I'm not kidding. In 1977 he would be retried and sent to prison where he died. Two others were eventually put on trial in 2000 and convicted of murder. Only one of the four escaped justice by conveniently dying. C'est la vie. None of their names are worthy of mention.
Oh, I wish I was in Dixie
Oy vey! Oy vey!
It would seem to me that Jim Crow is hellbent on taking his weird act on a national comeback tour. That is precisely what those proposed "Voter ID Laws" were all about. The GOP has been taken over by the ideological heirs of the racist Dixiecrats of yore - and has been corrupted beyond redemption in the process. The "party of Abraham Lincoln" has devolved into the party of Uncle Fester. They know goddamned well that it has become politically impossible for them to win office on the national level. They need to deny the ballot to as many people as possible - starting with black people. Nowadays the success of the Republicans depends upon the suppression of votes. Think about that.
PREDICTION:
Unless those voter ID laws are successfully implemented between now and then, a Democratic administration will succeed another Democratic administration on Inauguration Day 2017. Do you know when the last time that happened? When Franklin Pierce handed over the reigns of power to stuffy old James Buchanan on March 4, 1857. It hasn't happened since - check the history books. And it might very well be that the first black president bequeaths the office to the first woman president. The juiciest irony of all is that most of the Democrats of 1857 were ingrained racists and (it goes without saying) sexist. Had they known of this possibility they would have disbanded the party then and there. Life is funny that way, you know?
"Now is the time to rise from the dark and desolate valley of segregation to the sunlit path of racial justice. Now is the time to open the doors of opportunity to all of God's children. Now is the time to lift our nation from the quicksands of racial injustice to the solid rock of brotherhood."
Martin Luther King, 28 August 1963
George Wallace, Nick Katzenbach, Vivian Malone and James Hood are all gone now. Five months and eleven days after he reached out to touch the conscience of a nation, Jack Kennedy went to Dallas. Four and-a-half years after that, Dr. King went to Memphis. Fifty years on, 1963 clings to the American soul. It lights the darkest American night. It won't let go. I hope it never does.
And we gazed upon the chimes of freedom flashing. Wasn't that a time?
Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
SUGGESTED READING
Parting the Waters: America in the King Years
by Taylor Branch
The best book I've ever read about the Civil Rights struggle in America (1955-1968) by a first rate historian.
SUGGESTED VIEWING:
President Kennedy's address to the American people on the subject of Civil Rights, 11 June 1963:
`
This was the most important speech made by an American president in the twentieth century I believe. And the incredible thing about this incredible oration is the fact that most of it was delivered extemporaneously.
SUGGESTED LISTENING
Puff the Magic Dragon
by Peter, Paul and Mary
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug0XpHn3seQ
A dragon lives forever
But not so little boys
Painted wings and giant strings
Make way for other toys....
JACKIE PAPER SOLD OUT, MAN!
For more recent postings on this site kindly go to the link below:
"The Rant" by Tom Degan
Overcoming since 2 June 2006
SUGGESTED LISTENING
Puff the Magic Dragon
by Peter, Paul and Mary
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug0XpHn3seQ
A dragon lives forever
But not so little boys
Painted wings and giant strings
Make way for other toys....
JACKIE PAPER SOLD OUT, MAN!
For more recent postings on this site kindly go to the link below:
"The Rant" by Tom Degan
Overcoming since 2 June 2006
posted by Tom Degan @ 3:29 AM
75 comments
75 Comments:
Oh Tom, "playing the race card" AGAIN? How pathetic.
Seriously? One of your finer efforts. Let freedom ring.
Tom,
Are you claiming that any white person who did not vote for Obama in a state he did not carry is a racist? You can prove that?
Does logic follow that any black person who didn't vote for Obama's opponent is a racist?
Could Obama won his elections with out white votes?
put an end to the claim that whites are racist.
Let's expand this a bit further, did you vote for the ticket that included Sarah Palin? Why not, got something against women?
Of course you don't, but to assume a vote against a person automatically paints them as anti women or racist is crazy. You voted for the other team because it best reflected you positions. Nothing wrong with that.
Would you vote for a ticket that had a black conservative and Hispanic conservative running against two white liberals? I doubt it, because it is not the race or color of the persons skin you are voting for but their character of the persons and their positions.
Right?
Freedom and liberty would be ringing even louder today, if it were not for the least transparent, most involved in invading our private lives Presidency in our nations history. A President who happens to be depending on how you look at things, half white or half black.
Race it not the primary focus of the Constitution. Race is not the basis for legislation. It is the effect of the legislation on the Constitution promised rights and the relationships between the Federal govt and the State govt and the private individual that should be the focus. The focus should not be on how a law or act effects a group of people, defined by class, wealth, union membership or race.
Boy, you can sure tell that Chuck is a "dittohead". Probabaly has a picture of Glenn Beck on his bedroom ceiling as well.
Ah, Mozart, how nice it to see you are dreaming of how my bedroom looks. Will you please be my friend on facebook? The subject of this Mozart, as much as I hate break into your dream world about my bedroom, is racism. How many hours do you listen to Beck/Limbaugh in a day or a week? So far this week, my total is zero.
Next crazy post from Mozart in 45 minutes.
Does this mean Noam Chomsky is racist? He is disagreeing with Obama and who knows may not have even voted for Obama. Is he therefore a racist?
In a wide-ranging interview with GRITtv host Laura Flanders, MIT professor and author Noam Chomsky plainly stated that President Barack Obama’s administration is “dedicated to increasing terrorism” all around the world.
Damned summer sun, caused Obama a problem, must because it's racist.
MSNBC host and Obama sycophant Chris Matthews blamed the sun for spoiling the president’s speech in Berlin today.
“I think a lot of the problem he had today was the late afternoon sun in Berlin ruined his use of the teleprompter and so his usual dramatic windup was ruined,” Matthews said immediately after the speech. “I think he was really struggling with the text there.”
Speaking behind a glass bulletproof shield, Obama appeared to be using the text of the speech rather than reading off of teleprompters.
Tom, Tom, Tom...
You ought to know by now that those who consider themselves "conservatives" don't like to be considered racists. Many of them genuinely don't care about skin color. They simply believe in equal opportunity, not equal outcomes.
I hope my conservative "friends" out there appreciate that. I do not consider them "racists."
Their party, leadership, and punditry, on the other hand, are a bunch of would-be "nigger-lynchers."
I hope my "friends" aren't upset with me! If so--they should really talk to their party leadership.
It's Rush Limbaugh citing "white guilt" for why we haven't impeached Obama yet over the 'nontroversies' that have been conjured. No matter what my "friends" might feel about immigration--'sovereign nation,' 'criminals sneaking in,' or 'job takers,' if you look at the policies put forth by the GOP they have nothing to do jobs, our sovereignty, or even legalities. It's about the vote! Over the next 13 years, the GOP doesn't believe it can be enticing to Latinos and is fearful it would Texas and Florida with more Latino voters.
To repeat: In the next decade, my "friends" party could not make a competitive grab for Latinos.
It's my friends' constituency that is actually sending money to a killer in Florida. It's perfectly okay that Zimmerman shot Martin, even after being told to 'leave it alone.'
It is my friends' party suggesting that elections are being one by the minorities in big cities and their solution has been to try and change the electoral process.
It's is my 'friends' party who consistently and frequently raise the Kenyan issue and remind us that our President's middle name is "Hussein."
These things, my 'friends' are very much racist. Should my conservative 'friends' take issue with this, they should direct their comments to their party, leadership, and punditry.
Another good post Tom!
Jay
http://loraxlog.blogspot.com
Abe Lincoln must be rolling over in his grave now that a black man as President is trampling on the Civil Rights of Americans by monitoring their phone records! Even George Dubya Bush didn't do that!
"Their party, leadership, and punditry, on the other hand, are a bunch of would-be "nigger-lynchers."
Proof please, to support your statement.
What "RACE" is an illegal immigrant?
Isn't the LAW blind to the color of person? Why do liberals continue to make any issue an issue of race? Show me one that when there is a difference point of view that is not what Democrat/liberals/progressive fall back on as a means of defending their position or use to attack their opposition. We can not cut taxes because it will effect minorities adversely, we can not close govt programs because minorities need them.
Jay Jay Jay are you saying the only reason minorities vote for Democrats is because of what the Democrats will give them once in power vs. the Conservatives who will give them "equal opportunity, not equal outcomes"? Sounds like you, Jay, do not believe that minorities have the same high skill levels as non minorities. That they can not be successful without the help of a person of the majority race, or an action preventing the majority from becoming too successful.
That is VERY racist of you.
"Anonymous" (How brave of you to 'represent.')
If I take a guess about what race is an illegal immigrant, I'd have to defer to your party's talking points, which would be Latinos. It's not exactly like your party has been concerned about Canadians.
Were this law truly color blind and was truly designed to curb all immigration; we'd be talking about a fence around the entire U.S. and your party wouldn't be concerned about not courting Latino voters in 13 years.
I have no position to defend, so I don't feel behooved to 'defend' anything. Why is it with the evidence I present, parrots like yourself feel some slavish devotion to ignore your leadership's hypocrisy?
On behalf on all Democrats, we aren't all that keen about 'hand outs'--we're just less keen on starvation and rampant homelessness. Plus, we don't lose our freakin' minds when kids get a school lunch or grandma gets a visit from Meals On Wheels. We're just not a stingy and cheap as you boys. Plus the military can have a bake sale. Seems to work out well for our schools.
I'm not exactly certain where you got the silly notion of as to where I placed a value on minorities intelligence or capability. In fact, I never mentioned anything about government gifts, I merely put into evidence, topics your party and punditry have championed. That is my proof.
According to the great “good conservative” thinkers, we know only liberals, and Obama, are the racists.
"...a guy who has a deep-seated hatred for white people or the white culture...This guy is, I believe, a racist." - Glenn “not a racist” Beck, on Obama
"How do you get promoted in a Barack Obama administration? By hating white people."
"You know, racism in this country is the exclusive province of the left." – Rush “not a racist” Limbaugh
Harvard Professor Henry Louis Gates? "He's a racist. He's an angry racist." Sonja Sotomayor? "She's a bigot. She's a racist," Mr. Limbaugh said.
Then there were Tea Party rallies with signs of Obama with a spear and swastika and bone through his nose.
NOT ONE Tea Party member expressed outraged over those images. Not one Republican speaker at the rallies was bothered by it.
Why?
The Right had no qualms about the racist “Pimp” deception to smear ACORN either.
Why was Beck’s accusation that Obama has a “deep seated hatred for white people” tolerated? FOX(R) paid him millions after that comment. Why no condemnation of Limbaugh painting liberals as racists? Not a peep. But listen to the howl of reaction from the Right when a liberal suggests the true fact that there are racists among them.
One side is clearly waaaay over-sensitive to this issue, while projecting such qualities upon the other.
It is abundantly clear the Right is reluctant to even recognize racism against Obama. Yet they’re very happy to accuse blacks and liberals of racism, usually for nothing more than pointing out the facts I have shown above.
On Monday, May 6, Robert Rector and Jason Richwine of the “good conservative” Heritage Foundation published a study of the fiscal effects of immigration.
“Race is different in all sorts of ways, and probably the most important way is in IQ,” - Jason "not a racist" Richwine
"When you take a look at Colin Powell, you have to wonder whether that's an endorsement based on issues or whether he's got a slightly different reason for preferring President Obama." – John “not a racist” Sununu
“Let me just be candid: My party is full of racists, and the real reason a considerable portion of my party wants President Obama out of the White House has nothing to do with the content of his character, nothing to do with his competence as commander-in-chief and president, and everything to do with the color of his skin, and that's despicable.” - Retired Army Col. Lawrence Wilkerson, Republican and Former Colin Powell Aide
NOT ONE “good conservative” will denounce their leaders. Why is that?
One thing for sure, racists have no problem with it.
Their leaders say only liberals are racists. They whine about being accused of racism solely for disagreeing with Obama.
Right. Never mind that is never the case. But this is what their cult leaders tell them to repeat. And they ALL do, abundantly. Look around and see it in plain view.
One thing for sure, racists have no problem with it.
These are Just the Facts, friends.
Dave W "Even George Dubya Bush didn't do that!"
MAINWAY.
Anonymous "Jay Jay Jay are you saying the only reason minorities vote for Democrats is because of what the Democrats will give them once in power vs. the Conservatives who will give them 'equal opportunity, not equal outcomes'?"
No. They can hear the dogwhistles. Hispanic-Americans, too. Women can hear the slut-shaming.
The GOP's "Vote for me so that I can save the country from you people" is not voter outreach. Not good voter outreach, anyway.
Jay,
Starving kids and homeless thousands? Have you for got that there is a Democrat in the White House?
How can that be?
Tom, I have been reading The Rant for several years now and this issue was the best I have read here. You are definitely getting better with age!
Jay,
Are you attempting to say that to be opposed to Democrat programs of handouts means you want staving children and homeless?
Is there no other way than to create a growing federal govt to create a and manage a safety net for those who are unable due to no fault of their own to compete in an open market place of ideas and work skills?
Doesnt it make sense that the goal of a President would be to create a growing economy in the private sector so there are fewer people depending on govt programs instead of promoting access to the federal assistance plans in an attempt to grow the numbers of people who have to depend apon?
What happens when there are fewer citizens working and sending their taxes to the govt than those who are not working and relying on the taxes being handed out to them in the form of assistance? I believe that in1968 there were 58 workers for every person receiving federal disability income. I believe in 2013 the number was 13.
I understand that the ratio of workers paying into SS and those recieving SS funds today is 4:1. Without using greed, racism and lack of compassion as a part of your answer, how long do you think this trend can continue?
Tom, Jay Mozart, for you reading pleasure, more GOP racism to point out!
Elbert Guillory, a Democratic state senator in Louisiana, recently made headlines when he announced he was now Elbert Guillory, Republican state senator in Louisiana, in the process becoming the state’s first African American Republican lawmaker since Reconstruction. This week, Guillory released a video explaining his party switch, which he says is rooted in the GOP’s anti-slavery foundations.
“In recent history, the Democratic Party has created the illusion that their agenda and their policies are what’s best for black people,” Guillory said over plaintive piano. “Somehow it’s been forgotten that the Republican Party was founded in 1854 as an abolitionist movement with one simple creed: that slavery is a violation of the rights of man.”
“It was Republicans in Congress who authored the Thirteenth, Fourteenth, and Fifteenth Amendments, giving former slaves citizenship, voting rights and due process of law. The Democrats on the other hand were the party of Jim Crow. It was Democrats who defended the rights of slave owners.”
Guillory contrasted this 150-year-old version of the Republican Party with his interpretation of contemporary left wing politics.
“At the heart of liberalism is the idea that only a great and powerful big government can be the benefactor of social justice for all Americans. But the left is only concerned with one thing: control. And they disguise this control as one thing: charity. Programs such as welfare, food stamps? These programs aren’t designed to lift black Americans out of poverty. They were always intended as a mechanism for politicians to control the black community. The idea that blacks, or anyone for that matter, need the government to get ahead in life is despicable.
“And even more important, this idea is a failure. Our communities are just as poor as they have always been. Our schools continue to fail children. Our prisons are filled with young black men who should be at home, being gathers. Our self-initiative and our self-reliance have been sacrificed in exchange for allegiance to our overseers, who control us by making us dependent on them.”
Probably a big fan of Beck and Limbaugh, right JIT?
In Joe Biden’s lunk-headed immigration speech, where he says that his legally emigrated great, great, great grandfather wouldn’t have been able to come here today because people want to stop ILlegal immigration, he refers to himself and Obama as co-presidents before he corrects himself as an aside.
He’s getting better, though. In the past he’s out and out called himself the president, including this most pitiful gaffe at the last inauguration.
I have a theory as to why Joe does this – an I’m sticking to it.
JOE BIDEN IS A RACIST and HE CAN’T UNDERSTAND HOW A BLACK MAN IS PRESIDENT WHILE THE WHITE GUY IS VICE PRESIDENT.
JOE BIDEN IS A RACIST
Only a few thousand turned out for Obama's Brandenburg Gate speech.
They know he is an empty suit and Bull & Shit instead of Hope & Change.
The rest of the world no longer gets tingles up their leg when he reads his speech from his teleprompter. Only the liberal buffoons here still sleep with their Obama Hope and Change Tshirts.
Tom...I just brgan following your rant....I find your comments to be thought provoking and well-formed. I was 16 in 1963, and I sensed the world was changing. It was a magical time! Thanks for posting so many critical memories!
In the new world of the NSA, the only secret left is Barack Obama's college grades.
The American people are cooked with Obama. He won his way into office by massive vote fraud. Whoever is behind him and his way to the top are of the worst sort. They are destroying families, countries and what is good in this world. There is no good reason to support this man who has trampled our civil liberties, used intimidation and threats to get his way. He is of the worst sort traveling the world with his classless wife while using millions and millions of dollars of poor taxpayers money. Families go hungry and he and his wife party while Rome burns.
Wow. The nuts are poppin’.
MO,
We see you have proven “Dave W:” utterly wrong, and he proceeded to double down on his hate and ignorance. The poor, frightened little cultist needs to scamper from one name to another.
But nuts love other nuts, don’t they?
Elbert Guillory seems to think today’s mammon serving Republicans are led by Lincoln. As do all Republicans, he’s only out to represent and shill for Big Money. He drank the koolade so heartily he even refers to the "democrat party" on his website.
He was a fellow oily member, along with oil-soaked Mary Landrieu, of Louisiana's "democrat party". (BTW has anyone else noticed whenever the non-existent "democrat party" is invoked, something stupid and Right Wing follows.)
From 2009:
This week's "Peep Goat" column, out on newsstands tomorrow, reports on the level of support state Rep. Elbert Guillory is picking up from high profile Lafayette business and political leaders in his campaign for the District 24 state senate seat...beer distributor Herb Schilling, oilman Don Briggs, insurance mogul, politico, and Jindal’s boxing Commissioner Bobby Dupre...”
Looks like they have a new servant on the corporate plantation.
Helping the poor just isn’t as rewarding as serving mammon.
A real man of the people...as long as they’re rich.
But they really attract stupid fools also think their interests are represented by the "publican party".
Guillory: “But the left is only concerned with one thing: control.”
Never mind the US House of Representatives is controlled by Republicans despite the fact more Americans voted for Democratic representation. Can we say “hypocrite”?
And the poor, poor wittow cwybaby Rightes whine and whine about the evil Democratic Party. Yes the party that more Americans voted for. The cult is indoctrinated to hate democracy, scorn the poor, and care only for the welfare of the rich.
Just ask a Rightie to explain how his politics differ from that of the narrow agenda of the economic elites.
Not only won’t they do it, they can’t do it. And as Just the Facts pointed out, they cannot even condemn the race baiting hate spewed by their spokesmen.
Yes, these are the "real Americans" who despise and hate their fellow democracy supporting citizens who understand the need for safety nets and corporate responsibility to the public.
There's the right thing and then there's the "Right wing thing".
Big difference.
Looks like their is a "Big Difference" in Obama's approval rating Dave Dubya.
His abuse of power and trampling of civil liberties can't be swept under the rug.
The man is an empty suit Dave Dubya, its time to wake up and smell the coffee.
George Bush would never attempt to kill American citizens with a drone or tap the phone records of reporters in the Associated Press, or use the IRS to intimidate opposing viewpoints, or lie about the events of Benghazi.
So what would be the response to:
Just ask a Rightie to explain how his politics differ from that of the narrow agenda of the economic elites.
Not only won’t they do it, they can’t do it. And as Just the Facts pointed out, they cannot even condemn the race baiting hate spewed by their spokesmen.
The reaction?
Why, praise Bush and blame Obama, of course. For Bush "never lied" and "never abused power" and never used the Justice Department for political purposes...except he did all those things.
Just blame the black guy though, and even his wife.
How white of you.
Face it Dave, you're an idiot.
And based on what you said about Elbert Guillory a state Senator from Louisiana, a racist as well. Why didn't the party of Hope and Change kick him out if he was so bad?
Face it Dave, your dislike any Black who flees the liberal plantation, for racial reasons only.
That makes you a racist and an idiot at that.
Dave Dubya,
Did you even read what Senator Guillory said about what he has seen and experianced under the policy's that the Democrats have enflicted on Black Americans? Did you even for a nano second review what he as lived as a result of the policy's of the Democrat Party? Did you examine the result of the Democrat party policy's that Senator Guillory shared as what the Democrat Party has in store for Hispanics? Even after reading his first person experiance he gave us, do you still believe that it is the GOP that is hurting America's minority's?
Or did you kick into your mode of personal attack on the messenger because you could not defeat his message? It's not the first time a liberal has done this and no doubt will it be the last.
Dave, you are so predictable. Didn't even make an effort
to argue against the Senators reasons, instead you
kicked into a personal smear attack with out a thought.
Dave, you are such a liberal tool.
Oh, boy. Here we go. The cultist needs to throw personal accusations instead of offering reason, facts and information. No surprise there. They really do cling to their hate and cult beliefs.
I used information from Guillory’s website to show we have a new servant of mammon on the corporate plantation. No challenge to that fact. All races are accepted for that position.
Democrats have enflicted on Black Americans?... a result of the policy's of the Democrat Party?
(BTW has anyone else noticed whenever the non-existent "democrat party" is invoked, unsubstantiated Right Wing babble follows?)
About those “democrat policies”. The Senate has been close to an even split, but look who has controlled the House MOST of the time.
104th Congress 1995–1997 Senate – R House - R
105th Congress 1997–1999 Senate –R House – R
106th Congress 1999–2001 Senate – R House – R
107th Congress 2001–2003 Senate – D+R House – R
!08th Congress 2003–2005 Senate – R House – R
109th Congress 2005–2007 Senate – R House - R
110th Congress 2007–2009 Senate – D (49-49) House - D
111th Congress 2009–2011 Senate – D House – D
112th Congress 2011–2013 Senate - D House - R
113th Congress 2013–2015 Senate – D House – R
How about that? More R’s than D’s. Better blame the D’s, right? That would be wrong, but “Right wing”.
Would an “idiot” also forget the Republicans had control of the White House, Senate and House under most of Bush’s two terms? Seems so.
Would a “tool” keep repeating the non-existent name “democrat party”? Seems so.
Would a “racist” ignore requests to condemn race-baiting hate from FOX(R) and Limbaugh? Seems so.
Just ask a Rightie to explain how his politics differ from that of the narrow agenda of the economic elites.
Not only won’t they do it, they can’t do it. And as Just the Facts pointed out, they cannot even condemn the race baiting hate spewed by their spokesmen.
The reaction?
Why, call ME a racist, of course. Standard cult programming,
Did you even read what Senator Guillory said
Duh. I quoted from his website.
Or did you kick into your mode of personal attack on the messenger because you could not defeat his message?
Well, coming from an “idiot racist tool” Back at ya, sport. Keep projecting.
So typical, and predictable as day and night. Also very entertaining.
Keep it coming, troll. You are not only, hysterical, but you embody the worst of human nature; hatred built on ignorance.
Dave Dubya,
Liberal Tool, what is your response to the claims the Senator made about the effects of the Democrat Party policy's on Black Americans?
Crickets, anyone hear crickets?
I don't care what the Senator's website says, what the name of his dog is, or if in 1965 his great Uncle voted for a Republican. Deal with the issue, it's not about relativism, it's about reality. The real impact of liberal Democrat Party policy's on their intended benefactors.
BTW nice to see you have come clean and admitted you are AKA Just the Facts.
Come on Dave, blame Limbaugh or Beck or the GOP for this racism. Better still, tell us why from your view of things this is acceptable and NOT racist?
"The tattoo on his face says, “Kill Whitey” in block letters, and cops say the gun he carried was loaded and unlicensed.
But that didn’t stop Maruse Heath — head of the Philadelphia chapter of the New Black Panther Party — from claiming that he’s really all about charity and outreach as he was arraigned on a gun-possession charge in Manhattan last night.
“It is my understanding that the New Black Panther Party is the functional equivalent of the KKK,” Assistant District Attorney Christopher Ryan countered as Heath, 41, was ordered held in lieu of $75,000 bail for getting busted allegedly with a gun in Harlem Thursday night.
Heath, aka “King Salim Shabazz,” was arrested on Adam Clayton Powell Jr. Boulevard as he left a meeting of New Black Panther Party members. The group had gathered to plan a 15th-anniversary Million Man March commemoration, scheduled for Harlem on Sept. 7.
Heath was unjustly “jumped” by cops as he left the meeting and walked near Seventh Avenue, said his lawyer, Brad Foster, in arguing unsuccessfully for low bail.
“It is no crime to belong to the Black Panther Party,” the lawyer argued. The group does, “charity work within the local community, outreach to the homeless, and works with at-risk youth who are at risk of becoming criminals.”
Since the New Black Panther Party is all about "charity and outreach" wonder if the IRS has examined their tax returns?
Come on Dave, blame Limbaugh or Beck or the GOP for this racism. Better still, tell us why from your view of things this is acceptable and NOT racist?
I called the Limbaugh/Beck vitriol what it was. Race-baiting hatred. And you can’t even bring yourself to condemn it.
You’ve had your chance. We can only surmise you agree. Just like all racists.
And you cannot tell us where your ideology supports democracy, government safety nets and public service, Constitutional general welfare, or anything else other than the narrow agenda of the economic elites.
Crickets, anyone hear crickets? Indeed.
Hearing things are we? Along with blindness to all my facts and evidence, too.
response to the claims the Senator made about the effects of the Democrat Party policy's on Black Americans?
Claims unsupported by evidence amounts to propaganda. The Republican control of most of our government for the past two decades addresses that non-point. Why didn’t they fix it when they were in power, sport?
Can’t blame Republicans for anything, can you? Of course not. Bet you “forgot” the Bushies left us close to a depression in 09.
Did you even read what Senator Guillory said
And:
I don't care what the Senator's website says,
LOL! Now this speaks for itself. Hilarious.
Got some more comedy for us, sport?
Come on Dave, you can focus I know you can.
How about responding to what the Senator said the effects of liberal policy's have been on Black Americans. You sure are trying to dodge doin that aren't you. Wonder why?
Nice try at spreading the blame on the GOP with you laughable claim that the GOP has controlled most of our govt for the past two decades. Pure desperation on your part to make that claim.
Try to adjust this, if the GOP did control as you claim, why would the Senator leave the party that now controls 2/3 of our govt for one that controls one third?
Face it, you just can't stand it when on of the residents from the liberal plantation flees to a free state and tells the truth about what he has seen and experienced. I love it how your only response to those events is to launch into the politics of personal distruction, personal attacks and deflection.
Dave, you are such a tool of the left, you have become the laughing stock of the inter net.
Nice try at spreading the blame on the GOP with you laughable claim...
LOL! Yes, as everyone in the cult knows, the GOP is entirely blameless.
I LOVE how facts are a "laughable claim" to the cult that says the GOP is blameless...And Rush and Beck are blameless...and divine right of wealth is the scope and measure of their mammonite ideology.
It is incredible how angry, closed minded, and utterly fact-free they get defending that ideology.
More, please.
Aw Davy you having a hard time keeping your story straight?
"the GOP is entirely blameless"
Another dodge of the question another attempt to put the focus on the party the Senator is joining, not the one he is leaving, and a very subtle admission (but it's the first one from Dogmatic Dave, the Liberal Tool AKA JTF) that the Dems might share blame and not be perfect.
Do you agree or disagree with the claims the Senator made about the effects of the democratic policy's on Black Americans?
Aww, still no facts, sport? No wonder we needed Just the Facts for some reality around here.
No facts, but a demand for an answer. isn't that precious, coming from someone incapable of sharing information while denying facts?
Just to be sporting, because you're not, and to offer an answer, which you don't, I'll address your item concerning whether I agree or disagree with the claims the Senator made.
I already addressed his claim about the left.
Guillory: “But the left is only concerned with one thing: control.”
Never mind the US House of Representatives is controlled by Republicans despite the fact more Americans voted for Democratic representation. Can we say “hypocrite”?
And as far as his taking the identical position as the Republican Party on Democratic policies, I will have to disagree with the partisan political BS he spews to appease his party's corporate plantation masters.
No more answers for you. It's your turn to answer some questions, unless, you’re all about double standards. You're fair and balanced, right?
From JTF:
Why was Beck’s accusation that Obama has a “deep seated hatred for white people” tolerated? FOX(R) paid him millions after that comment. Why no condemnation of Limbaugh painting only liberals as racists?
Explain how your politics differ from that of the narrow agenda of the economic elites.
See if you can answer with facts and information, without empty slogans and unsubstantiated accusations, and without calling someone names.
Aww, still no facts, sport? No wonder we needed Just the Facts for some reality around here.
No facts, but a demand for an answer. isn't that precious, coming from someone incapable of sharing information while denying facts?
Just to be sporting, because you're not, and to offer an answer, which you don't, I'll address your item concerning whether I agree or disagree with the claims the Senator made.
I already addressed his claim about the left.
Guillory: “But the left is only concerned with one thing: control.”
Never mind the US House of Representatives is controlled by Republicans despite the fact more Americans voted for Democratic representation. Can we say “hypocrite”?
And as far as his taking the identical position as the Republican Party on Democratic policies, I will have to disagree with the partisan political BS he spews to appease his party's corporate plantation masters.
No more answers for you. It's your turn to answer some questions. You're fair and balanced, right?
From JTF:
Why was Beck’s accusation that Obama has a “deep seated hatred for white people” tolerated? FOX(R) paid him millions after that comment. Why no condemnation of Limbaugh painting only liberals as racists?
Explain how your politics differ from that of the narrow agenda of the economic elites.
See if you can answer with facts and information, without empty slogans and unsubstantiated accusations, and without calling someone names.
How about it? Whatcha got, sport?
HA. Double clicked just for the reading retention impaired.
Sport, just answer and deal with this before you hurt yourself strutting your peacock feathers.
"Do you agree or disagree with the claims the Senator made about the effects of the democratic policy's on Black Americans?"
BTW the subject this thread is not about Limbaugh or Beck or Meadows or any other media personality, no matter how much you try to change it.
Do you agree or disagree with the claims the Senator made about the effects of the democratic policy's on Black Americans??
Here is the Senator's statement you keep dodging.
"Elbert Guillory, a Democratic state senator in Louisiana, recently made headlines when he announced he was now Elbert Guillory, Republican state senator in Louisiana, in the process becoming the state’s first African American Republican lawmaker since Reconstruction. This week, Guillory released a video explaining his party switch, which he says is rooted in the GOP’s anti-slavery foundations.
“In recent history, the Democratic Party has created the illusion that their agenda and their policies are what’s best for black people,” Guillory said over plaintive piano. “Somehow it’s been forgotten that the Republican Party was founded in 1854 as an abolitionist movement with one simple creed: that slavery is a violation of the rights of man.”
“It was Republicans in Congress who authored the Thirteenth, Fourteenth, and Fifteenth Amendments, giving former slaves citizenship, voting rights and due process of law. The Democrats on the other hand were the party of Jim Crow. It was Democrats who defended the rights of slave owners.”
Guillory contrasted this 150-year-old version of the Republican Party with his interpretation of contemporary left wing politics.
“At the heart of liberalism is the idea that only a great and powerful big government can be the benefactor of social justice for all Americans. But the left is only concerned with one thing: control. And they disguise this control as one thing: charity. Programs such as welfare, food stamps? These programs aren’t designed to lift black Americans out of poverty. They were always intended as a mechanism for politicians to control the black community. The idea that blacks, or anyone for that matter, need the government to get ahead in life is despicable.
“And even more important, this idea is a failure. Our communities are just as poor as they have always been. Our schools continue to fail children. Our prisons are filled with young black men who should be at home, being gathers. Our self-initiative and our self-reliance have been sacrificed in exchange for allegiance to our overseers, who control us by making us dependent on them.”
The Senator's last two paragraph rip the lid off the liberal lie. Read it those who brave enough to question their beliefs, ignore it if you are a liberal racist.
The idea that Liberal policies are solely responsible for all the problems of black people in this country is actually hilarious!
To imply that Republicans, if only given the chance, would improve the lives and destinies of the black population is partisan politics brought to an impossibly sharp point.
After Katrina, a white southern Republican politician said in relation to all the dead and displaced blacks of the ninth ward" We could not clean up New Orleans, but God did"
Don't forget the Republicans care so much for blacks they want to make it harder for them to vote. They love to scare people with "New Black Panther" pictures too.
The party that ended slavery now wants to destroy unions and eliminate minimum wage.
I could go on...
Let the black guy be president we will show the world we are not bigots. The word "token" comes to mind.
Since his election the bigots have done everything to make Obama out to be subhuman and the cause of all our problems.
The same garbage Hitler used to encourage (successfully) hate against the Jews.
No surprise when you have guys like Mitch leading the Republican? party. Their stated position, they will do nothing to help the president do anything for the country, even if that means hurting the country.
Hate and anger, what a trip.
James,
And cleaning up NOLA is racism?
Showing pictures of New Black Panther people with "Kill Whitey" tattoo on a members forehead shouldn't scare you? What was the purpose of the tattoo?
How are Republicans selecting certain groups of voters to make it more difficult that other voters to vote? How do you do that? Maybe like not counting military absentee votes? How do Republicans know how a person is going to vote in order to make their vote more difficult to cast? Does this mean that Senator Guillory will now have an easier time to vote than he did before he switched party's?
Do you agree or disagree with the claims the Senator made about the effects of the democratic policy's on Black Americans??
Here is the Senator's statement you keep dodging.
"Elbert Guillory, a Democratic state senator in Louisiana, recently made headlines when he announced he was now Elbert Guillory, Republican state senator in Louisiana, in the process becoming the state’s first African American Republican lawmaker since Reconstruction. This week, Guillory released a video explaining his party switch, which he says is rooted in the GOP’s anti-slavery foundations.
“In recent history, the Democratic Party has created the illusion that their agenda and their policies are what’s best for black people,” Guillory said over plaintive piano. “Somehow it’s been forgotten that the Republican Party was founded in 1854 as an abolitionist movement with one simple creed: that slavery is a violation of the rights of man.”
“It was Republicans in Congress who authored the Thirteenth, Fourteenth, and Fifteenth Amendments, giving former slaves citizenship, voting rights and due process of law. The Democrats on the other hand were the party of Jim Crow. It was Democrats who defended the rights of slave owners.”
Guillory contrasted this 150-year-old version of the Republican Party with his interpretation of contemporary left wing politics.
“At the heart of liberalism is the idea that only a great and powerful big government can be the benefactor of social justice for all Americans. But the left is only concerned with one thing: control. And they disguise this control as one thing: charity. Programs such as welfare, food stamps? These programs aren’t designed to lift black Americans out of poverty. They were always intended as a mechanism for politicians to control the black community. The idea that blacks, or anyone for that matter, need the government to get ahead in life is despicable.
“And even more important, this idea is a failure. Our communities are just as poor as they have always been. Our schools continue to fail children. Our prisons are filled with young black men who should be at home, being gathers. Our self-initiative and our self-reliance have been sacrificed in exchange for allegiance to our overseers, who control us by making us dependent on them.”
The Senator's last two paragraph rip the lid off the liberal lie. Read it those who brave enough to question their beliefs, ignore it if you are a liberal racist.
Progressive organization is racist?
Activists criticize ‘lack of diversity’ at Netroots Nation
Black activists at the 2013 Netroots Nation conference blasted organizers and participants for what they described as a shocking “lack of diversity” at the progressive community’s flagship get-together.
“I want to touch on the lack of diversity at Netroots Nation,” remarked one black audience member to wild applause and cheers during a rowdy Saturday afternoon discussion with a panel of prominent black female activists.
“Although Netroots touts itself as being an incubator for ideas that challenge the status quo, judging from the racial make-up of the NN13 attendees, lack of diversity is one status quo that didn’t seem to be challenged enough,” Sharon Kyle, a blogger for LA Progressive, wrote in a post titled, “Netroots Nation Lacks Diversity.”
GOP and minority voters:
“Voter ID, which is gonna allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done." - GOP State House Majority Leader Mike Turazi (R-Allegheny)
Senate Republican Mike Bennett, from Bradenton, suggested it might be too easy to cast a ballot.
"We do make it convenient for people to vote," he said. "But I have to tell you, I don't have a problem making it harder. I want people in Florida to want to vote as bad as that person in Africa who walks 200 miles across the desert. This should not be easy. This should be something you should do with a passion."
Several states, including New Mexico and Florida, have enacted restrictive laws that interfere with the ability of groups to do voter registration drives. The Florida law was tied up in litigation filed by the Brennan Center and so has not been in effect for this election season.
A court refused to block the New Mexico law, and a number of community groups, especially those that work with volunteers, have not been able to register new voters.
Brennan Center for Justice: Early Voting Restrictions Most Heavily Disrupts Minority Voting .
Crist testifies in Senate that there was voter suppression in Florida
... And That Voter Fraud Of The Kind Voter ID Laws Would Counter Is Virtually Non-Existent
"Don't forget the Republicans care so much for blacks they want to make it harder for them to vote."
So, Dave, you think black people are less capable of obtaining ID cards? Or am I missing your point? If that's what you are saying, I'd be extremely offended by that notion if I were a black man.
Harley A.
Apparently Senator Elbert Guillory (a Black man) agrees with you. To quote a black person who has lived with the effects of liberalism.
“At the heart of liberalism is the idea that only a great and powerful big government can be the benefactor of social justice for all Americans. But the left is only concerned with one thing: control. And they disguise this control as one thing: charity. Programs such as welfare, food stamps? These programs aren’t designed to lift black Americans out of poverty. They were always intended as a mechanism for politicians to control the black community. The idea that blacks, or anyone for that matter, need the government to get ahead in life is despicable.
“And even more important, this idea is a failure. Our communities are just as poor as they have always been. Our schools continue to fail children. Our prisons are filled with young black men who should be at home, being gathers. Our self-initiative and our self-reliance have been sacrificed in exchange for allegiance to our overseers, who control us by making us dependent on them."
Must be painful to read much less answer if you are a liberal, as no one yet has responded to the points made.
Harley,
There you go with the "liberals are the REAL racists" BS. Thanks, Rush.
Read the links. My point was supported by Republicans. I included some of their supporting statements. You're also limiting the discussion to just ID's. (A republican tactic all the way.) The reality is deeper. Restrictions on registration, poll access, voter roll purges, etc. the list goes on.
Again, please read the information if you really want to know what offends black men. We're not talking about rich black men like the ones who want to serve on the corporate plantation.
The idea that blacks, or anyone for that matter, need the government to get ahead in life is despicable.
“And even more important, this idea is a failure. Our communities are just as poor as they have always been. Our schools continue to fail children. Our prisons are filled with young black men who should be at home, being gathers.
People of all colors and ages need the safety nets the radical Right hates. Safety nets are NOT a failure. The "job providers" have obviously FAILED to create jobs. Not overseas, though. Thank you very much.
“There you go with the "liberals are the REAL racists" BS. Thanks, Rush.”
No sir. Absolutely not. You might go and reread my post. I asked you for clarification of what seemed to me to be your point – and left you room to clarify it. If you clarified your point and showed that was not what you were saying, then I’m not making that claim at all. Thus my qualifying clause “If so”…
As for your concern of the “liberals are the real racists” vibe you are getting from most people on the right who are not racists, you might vacate that glass house you live in if you want to continue to throw rocks…
Your worn rhetoric, as you know, does not hold water with me. You don’t ever owe me a response, but if you choose to do so, it would be in your best interest to do so in good faith.
Dave Dubya " We're not talking about rich black men like the ones who want to serve on the corporate plantation."
4:08 PM
Thanks for the clarification!! That means I can be a racist towards a Black man if they make a certain amount of income.
But Dave, what if they are rich and became so by serving on the liberal govt plantation, can one still be racist towards those Black men?
And Dave you said "who want to serve on the corporate plantation" What does that mean, "want to"? That poor Black men are poor because they chose to not serve IE work to become rich? Is that what you are saying? If it is their choice, is that different from being poor because you are of a race that is discriminated against in the job market?
MOZART 1220, Jay, James, come quick, Dave Dubya has painted himself into a corner and needs you help to get out!
BLOG ALERT BLOG ALERT
Send help to "The Rant" by Tom Degan
Liberal Tool is failing to defend the undefendable liberal race policy.
THIS IS NO DRILL
DD -
Furthermore...
You make sweeping statements about Republicans wanting to make it harder for black people to vote, yet bristle when you are questioned as to one specific component of your own statement. I did not call you or anyone a racist, but I'll agree with you that it is not in good form to do so. Therefore, you and many others need to quit doing it with the abandon you do...
Every one of us wants SOME level of checks in any voting system. Right? So, on that basis, a freaking ID card wouldn't seem to be a draconian measure to any but the most ill-equiped and, frankly, dull-witted person who probably shouldn't be voting for the leader of the free world. Should we give aid and help where needed to obtain said ID? Absolutely - poverty or age should not stop you. But, to rail against an ID card on the surface is just plain silly.
ANY system can be foiled and people and parties will try - that's part of the human experience unfortunately. But, to add some credence to your argument, the least you could do is admit an ID card is not some over-the-top, unheard of measure - that premise simply lacks credibility. It is easily demonstrated that there are dozens of mundane situations in which we find ourselves in need of an ID card. Hell, I can't get into the gym I PAY for without an ID card. I can't check out a library book without an ID card. Sheesh - I can't believe this is actually an argument. It is surreal.
I'm done on this one - too frustrating. If this is where we are, I give up. We're hopeless as a serious society.
Harley,
This is my point:
"Don't forget the Republicans care so much for blacks they want to make it harder for them to vote."
Vote suppression, and admissions from Republicans, are my supporting evidence. What part don't you understand?
dull-witted person who probably shouldn't be voting for the leader of the free world Yeah, like the large percentage of R voters who believe Obama might be the anti-Christ, and a racist Marxist according to FOX()R and Limbaugh, and ACORN stole the election for him...in 2012. I'm not making this up. I've linked in previous threads to polls showing this to be true.
And you say I'm in a glass house? The Right Wing bubble distorts everything. Why? Because the RIght is concerned for only the economic elites. MOST of their agenda is directed at making the rich richer, and reducing voter turnout. This is what is not visible from the bubble. I've even asked for a Rightie to show us otherwise. Nada.
I've answered questions. My request remains unanswered:
Why was Beck’s accusation that Obama has a “deep seated hatred for white people” tolerated? FOX(R) paid him millions after that comment. Why no condemnation of Limbaugh painting only liberals as racists?
Explain how your politics differ from that of the narrow agenda of the economic elites.
I don't think you're playing the "fake misunderstanding", or sheer density, your fellow ideologue is doing, but did you read the links? Did you read the statements from Republicans? Did you read the race-baiting hate from the "good conservative" "not racist" spokesmen? Did you see my point that you are narrowing the issue by sticking only to voter ID's? Do you really believe none of the vote suppression actions were politically motivated and targeted at minority voters? And finally, are you calling the Republicans who admitted so much liars?
Dave,
You have lost all creditablity with you insane drive to get some kind of reaction about a couple of radio talk show hosts, while ignoring the question that has been posed to you about about the Black state senator in LA who switched from Dem to GOP.
In the first place you make the assumption that if a conservative posts here they must listen to Limbaugh or Beck or watch Fox News. That is the height of stereotyping your opponents and you do so with no chance at gaining any advantage in the debate while risking the lose of any position you may have to begin with.
That is a stupid as thinking only black men who want to be rich are selling their souls to the corporate plantation. Really dumb.
Harley A. "So, Dave, you think black people are less capable of obtaining ID cards? Or am I missing your point? If that's what you are saying, I'd be extremely offended by that notion if I were a black man."
You didn't need ID before, but now you do, to fight in-person voting fraud which is basically negligible. You okay with that? Now you have to pay for it. Still okay with that? Okay, you don't have to pay for it, but you have to pick it up from the DMV. Okay now? Now we've closed the nearest one and cut back the hours, some quite severely, on the other near ones (oh, and you don't have a car). Still okay? And by the way, we've extended the hours in DMVs no where near you, because people like you (*wink, wink*) don't go there to vote. Still okay with that? We've also cut back early voting. Still okay? We've stopped it thon weekend a week before the election, when "your people" historicaly don't vote, but we've closed it on the weekend before, when they do. Still okay? And it's got less machines per voter than the ones in "our" areas, or its machines are undermaintained. Still Okay? And there's off-duty, in-uniform cops running the lines at your polling place, just because. Still okay? And there are "voting integrity" workers walking the line, challenging you, just because. Still okay? And there are "True the Vote" workers walking the line, challenging you again, just because. Still okay? Good. You made it. Polling's closed. Come back tomorrow. Still okay? Let me tell you again that this is all to fight a phantom. Still okay? You shouldn't be.
...and don't get me started on allowing concealed carry licenses (which voters from one party are far more likely to have than the other), but not allowing university ID (or allowing it, but having certain standards and, no, the standards won't be released until after the semester starts), inaccurate robocalls ("There's no need to vote, your guy already won" or "Be sure to vote tomorrow" on the day of the election), voter caging or inaccurate voter roll purges (as in Florida, which repeatedly "cleared" its rolls of felons and of people whose names were similar to felons).
Virtually none of this fights in-person voter fraud, which barely exists anyway. It's just there to be one roadblock in front of another roadblock in front of another. Why? Because the the groups that are disproportionately hit tend to vote for the other party.
Why do they tend to vote for the other party? Because of crap like this.
One more time, sport.
You have lost all creditablity with you insane...yadda yadda, no fact, yadda yadda, accusation, and lie.
I answered. YOU DIDN”T. You prove yourself to be a hypocrite and a liar. We can see it’s no large leap from there to being a racist.
stupid as thinking only black men who want to be rich are selling their souls to the corporate plantation.
More fake misunderstanding, to be generous.
you make the assumption that if a conservative posts here they must listen to Limbaugh or Beck or watch Fox News.
There is zero assumption of anything on my part. But it would certainly be a fair assumption to see you are a dittohead and loyal ideologue. I'm merely noting the FACT you guys cannot dispute the Beck and Limbaugh quotes. I'm not calling anyone names, but we all know racists would agree with those quotes. And so far we see, you cannot or will not disagree. Logically we must acknowledge the real possibility you are a racist at worst or a willfully brainwashed cultist at best.
You also hypocritically demand answers, yet offer NONE IN RETURN. “Ignoring the question” is exactly what you have BEEN doing, sport. Projection again. That's more indication of Right Wing arrogance and double standards.
Again that’s not a great leap to being a racist.
There is also not one iota of indication from you that your ideology contradicts the agenda of the economic elites.
You're the one boxing yourself into a corner; a mean, arrogant, hypocritical, dishonest, and possibly racist corner.
You have given zero information to indicate otherwise. You just don’t do facts. You don’t do information. You parrot Right Wing ideology designed to dupe Americans into supporting the party of the rich. Deny this? Then show us some evidence to the contrary.
You also taunt, demand, and whine like spoiled brats who believe they are above and better than everyone else.
You offer nothing but sneering, mean-spirited scorn for people who you refuse the simple decency of good faith discussion.
That is not right, of course. But it is Right Wing. You are a classic example of such a raving wild-eyed ideologue.
But you know what? You have answered something, albeit unintentionally.
See if you can answer with facts and information, without empty slogans and unsubstantiated accusations, and without calling someone names.
And you proceeded to respond with no facts, no information, empty slogans, unsubstantiated accusations and outright lies.
Thank you for showing us all what you really are, and by extension the very core of an extreme, resentful, and hateful ideology. You are a loyal partisan hack, a true believer, a cultist, and a “Good Conservative”, but not a very good conservative person.
My Grandmother was a good conservative person. You are not a good conservative person at all. She was a never a nasty name-calling liar. You, however, can’t contain your hate and scorn for those who disagree with you.
You show up here for no other reason than to flaunt your inflated sense of moral superiority, to annoy, taunt, and insult, all to boost your arrogant, self-righteous, and closed minded ego.
You offer nothing but the darkness and deceit of a twisted, resentful, angry and deluded soul, based on your words that I pointed out.
I’m entertained by such exhibitions, but others are not.
Therefore, in consideration of others, (how's that for a concept, sport?) I’m done with you.
Excerpt from ACLU website...
"During the 2011 legislative sessions, states across the country passed measures to make it harder for Americans – particularly African-Americans, the elderly, students and people with disabilities – to exercise their fundamental right to cast a ballot. Over thirty states considered laws that would require voters to present government-issued photo ID in order to vote. Studies suggest that up to 11 percent of American citizens lack such ID, and would be required to navigate the administrative burdens to obtain it or forego the right to vote entirely."
So, in this excerpt, African-Americans as a race are categorically blended with the elderly, college students, and disabled people. And, the concern is that African Americans, as a race, would be required to "navigate the administrative burdens to obtain it or forgo the right to vote entirely."
Someone please correct my interpretation and explain to me why I shouldn't be offended if I were a black man.
MO -
I don't disagree that the voting process is open to fraud in all sorts of ways. I think it needs an overhaul - or at least a good re-evaluation. Problem is that we have foxes watching the henhouse - so what can we do?
The main aspect that floors me is the arbitrary decision we've made to rush the process as if we're late for a party. There was a time when it necessarily took weeks for the results. Now, with technology (that is VERY open to fraud) and the rabid media driving us to declare a victor 6 hours after polls open (because, after all, nothing is anything unless it is reported on the networks) - we have a perfect storm.
I simply think that you need to separate the intent of some from the potential merits of an ID card. It, like anything, can be open to fraud as well, but there is a real possibility it could solve some of the problems you describe, too.
Harley,
Someone please correct my interpretation and explain to me why I shouldn't be offended if I were a black man.
Are the elderly offended by this demographic? Are students offended? Are the disabled offended? Why should Blacks be offended when statistically they as a group share similar issues of transportation, access and opportunity to comply with voting restrictions? Of course this doesn't include the wealthier members of these groups.
Republicans know this and exploit it. THAT's what offends Blacks, students, the elderly, and disabled. It is by all measures, part of the political class war on the non-wealthy. It is power exercised by, and to maintain, the "divine right of wealth". It is a calculated promotion of the sacred and holy Bottom line for the most privileged of our society.
Even nuns were turned away from the polls for similar reasons.
ID law keeps nuns, students from polls
And as it happens, you're not of those groups, yet, so you are okay with the voter suppression. You've bought into the Right's trumped up "Voter Impersonation Fraud" fraud.
Want to cure all voter registration irregularities and the dozen or so cases of impersonation, but most of all reduce opposition voter participation? Eliminate voting for everyone but the rich. The "cure" is worse than the "disease", favors the Republican Party, and it undermines democracy.
But that's not the goal, yet.
Ideologically, the Right is mainly interested in keeping white and wealthy voters. They'd like more minority voters but as MO so eloquently stated, "Vote for me so that I can save the country from you people" is not good voter outreach. Their strategy is to reduce participation by the rest of us. Some of them even admitted this.
And you're okay with all that?
That's it! With liberals it's all about demographics, not the individual.
THAT IS WHY SENATOR Elbert Guillory a Black man said when he switched partys to the GOP:
"At the heart of liberalism is the idea that only a great and powerful big government can be the benefactor of social justice for all Americans. But the left is only concerned with one thing: control. And they disguise this control as one thing: charity. Programs such as welfare, food stamps? These programs aren’t designed to lift black Americans out of poverty. They were always intended as a mechanism for politicians to control the black community. The idea that blacks, or anyone for that matter, need the government to get ahead in life is despicable.
“And even more important, this idea is a failure. Our communities are just as poor as they have always been. Our schools continue to fail children. Our prisons are filled with young black men who should be at home, being gathers. Our self-initiative and our self-reliance have been sacrificed in exchange for allegiance to our overseers, who control us by making us dependent on them."
DD –
Just trying to draw a fine line on what you are saying…
Elderly people are inherently as a category physically weaker, often mentally not as sharp as they used to be, etc. Clearly a group of citizens we need to protect. (And, I did mention I was for aid for the elderly and poor for obtaining said ID cards).
Ok, students are young, green-behind-the-ears – need a little help maybe. I disagree, though, with the notion that they are somehow unable to obtain an ID card. They are resourceful enough to attend classes and manage school schedules. I could have obtained an ID card when I was 19 and I was nothing special. Anyway, I’ll give some leeway on this one.
The disabled – again, clearly a disadvantaged group that we as a society have and should continue to protect their well-being and insure they aren’t being marginalized.
Now, we come to the class of American black people as a race – which are explicitly called out in the ACLU excerpt and by yourself. You are telling me that the black race is less capable, weaker, than other races in America to the point they should be compared with elderly and disabled people? If the black person is not a college student, or an elderly person, or a disabled person, then what should qualify them to be included in this grouping of inherently weaker and/or less capable people?
The classification based on race doesn’t categorically fit and, on the surface, it sounds as if the classification is a convenient rhetorical tool to stir emotion rather than engage with a solid premise.
This is a HUGE discussion and one I hope folks are paying attention to…
Regarding the article on the nuns. I don’t ever believe we’ll have a system that will be completely devoid of problems, but as the LA Times article stated and as I believe would be the case normally… “Though state officials reported no significant problems, advocates monitoring polling places said there was occasional confusion.” Normal part of life – not rioting in the streets.
OBAMA ADMINISTRATION DECLARES WAR ON GOOD PAYING MIDDLE CLASS JOBS!
Daniel P. Schrag, a White House climate adviser and director of the Harvard University Center for the Environment, tells the New York Times "a war on coal is exactly what's needed."
Harley,
You are telling me that the black race is less capable, weaker, than other races in America to the point they should be compared with elderly and disabled people?
No, why would you even read that into what I wrote? Are you calling me a racist? Looks like it.
I'm telling you this:
"statistically they, as a group, share similar issues of transportation, access and opportunity to comply with voting restrictions. Of course this doesn't include the wealthier members of these groups."
Not having to do with race per se, but income and circumstances I listed. But if that looks to you like "Liberals are racists" and you want to tag liberals with thinking, "Blacks are inferior", then there's no discussion with you. You're bending others' words to suit you and Rush's prejudice.
Once again you seem to desire to limit the entire voter suppression to ID's. Did you bother to read what MO thoughtfully wrote?
Is that all okay with you?
Or do you still want to disingenuously pretend you just don't understand what we are saying? No wonder the brainwashed cult thinks Obama is a Muslim Marxist, and only liberals are racist.
Can you explain that for us? We promise not to twist your words.
Leno: 'IRS Has Ruled Obama Can Write Off First Half of His Second Term as a Total Loss'...
Jay Leno is a racist.
Hey Dave, more Democrat racism on display just for you, sport!
What will Thom Hartman and Ms. Meadows say? Will they demand the lawmaker step down?
A Democratic lawmaker from Minnesota criticized Tuesday’s Supreme Court decision on the Voting Rights Act by calling Justice Clarence Thomas “Uncle Thomas,” then saying he didn’t know “Uncle Tom” was a racist epithet.
Mr. Winkler, whose website says he has an undergraduate history degree from Harvard and a law degree from the University of Minnesota, seemed to dig the hole deeper in a subsequent tweet, in which he said the racism of the term “Uncle Tom” was disputed and unknown to him.
If Paula Deen must resign so should MN Rep Winkler.
DD -
You need to go reread (or read) my reply to MO. Without going to the trouble of answering each point, I granted that there are issues and dishonest people will try to game the system (and do try). My focus has been on the ID's because it is, in my estimation, a good idea. And, ironically, I think it could hinder the ability of dishonest people from trying to keep a valid voter from voting. I think it's a good idea and am amazed that 99% of people don't agree with it in concept. I'm not skirting the other issues.
And, no, I'm not calling you a racist. I don't think you're a racist. I just don't agree with classifying African Americans with elderly and disabled people and treating them as a protected class racially. And using them as a cover for promoting one's policies.
HarleyA
(account not working right)
Harley,
You did say "Dishonest people will try to game the system", but didn't clarify that any of those were Republicans suppressing voter registration, access to polls and imposing other new conditions for voting that were not in effect previously.
Since you never referred to GOP policy, it's difficult to know who you meant by "dishonest people".
Can't you put the words "dishonest" and "republican" in the same sentence?
Not trying to be snarky, but you've been vague on who the "dishonest people" are.
I just don't agree with classifying African Americans with elderly and disabled people
What do you mean by "classifying"? Are you saying they don't have anything in common? I don't mind being "classified" with fellow Americans if we share some statistical, geographic or demographic characteristics.
Don't you want to be "classified" as a fellow American with these people?
As long as the word classified is being used Blacks, students, elderly and disabled are not generally of the upper class, are they? Most of us in fact can be classified as not upper class.
Now, agree or disagree, you and I are "classified" with blacks, students, the elderly and the disabled.
Dave,
what should a person have to show to prove they can legally vote?
what should a person have to show to prove they can legally vote?
Why, show up, of course. ;-)
Dave,
Smart ass answer to a serious question. Just show up!
Smart ass Anonymous posters demanding answers, while never offering answers, deserve smart ass answers.
Yes - dishonest Republicans will try to game the system! And surely have. They are humans.
You really overestimate my attachment to the Republican party. The reason I don't use the term much is that I am not tied in to the tribal Rep/Dem false dichotomy. I'm an American concerned for our country.
As for the classification thing, you're missing my point I think.
Elderly, students, and disabled are all classifications of what I'll call "at risk for marginalization due to inherent mental, physical, or developmental deficiencies". (Though, as I've said, I don't really place students in that group - that's BS in my opinion.) Anyway, I think to classify a whole race in that same vein is condescending. Just my 2 cents. Take if for what it's worth. If it's merely a problem with poor communication on ACLU's (and your) part, then so be it. They need to better articulate. But, the rhetoric I've heard on more than one issue leads me to believe that there are many who feel African Americans need to be protected because they aren't as capable as the rest of the country. I would think they would find that offensive, though they can and do certainly benefit from the belief.
At what point do we move towards color blindness rather than overt color preferential treatment? I think it made sense at one point in our history - clearly. At some point we need to integrate or we risk reverse discrimination.
Good discussion. Said all I need to say... and I don't expect I'll change your viewpoint which is okay.
Harley,
During the 2011 legislative sessions, states across the country passed measures to make it harder for Americans – particularly African-Americans, the elderly, students and people with disabilities – to exercise their fundamental right to cast a ballot.
These are the groups most impacted by Republican vote suppression.
I think you're seeing "classified" or "categorization" under a different framing. You want to tie disability, race, or some other connection to the groups. All the groups have in common, in this context, is being adversely affected by GOP vote suppression.
It's not the ACLU's fault these groups share the effects. It is the GOP's, and only the GOP's fault.
Students and blacks are the groups deliberately targeted, while the elderly and disabled share certain life circumstances that include them with the groups affected.
That is the "classification" or "category". Nothing else. The groups all have both common and different circumstances accounting for the negative impact. Republican mandated restrictions on ID, registration, poll access, times, early voting, etc. all have negative effects on our democracy.
I honestly don't understand your difficulty here.
Dave,
When it comes to knowing smart asses, you'd get my vote for the position. Can dish it out but can't take it.
figures
just a liberal tool.
What should a person have to show to prove they can legally vote?
Another fine piece of journalism Tom.
This is an excerpt of my om blog post for the full blog: http://www.dutchheretic.com/blog/blog.htm
I was 7 year old when I saw white people with funny pointy hats march in a TV news broadcast, back then I was a fan of Zorro the masked hero I knew from the comic magazine and I thought these white masked men were the same, masked heroes..
I asked my mom if she could make me one of these.. she was silent for a moment and then said, "listen, not all people who wear masks are heroes, these people in their white robes are horrible people who murder other people because they hate people who have a different skin color and don't want to be caught by the police"
This made a huge impression on me but also raised new questions for me " different skin color?" that must have been like in another cartoon/comic strip I read about two boys named "Sjors en Sjimmie" (english: George and Jimmy) , you can find it in google
One was a straight haired blond, blue eyed boy and the other was black with red lips and curly hair, as I remember correctly they lived together with some Aunt and uncle and were best friends , like two brothers and had all kind of adventures.
Remember this was for children, but for me it was the only clue I had for people of different skin color, and they were friends !
This was in the Netherlands 1960's
What I want to say with this story, I grew up in a country without experiencing racism until someone imported it there ..
And this taught me one thing when people accuse me of using the "racist card" most of the times it is because they feel personally addressed, or exposed as the real racists..
Using the racist card, does not make you a racist..
It is exposing racism for what it is, indoctrinated hatred ..
This needs to be exposed every time over and over again until people start to be ashamed about it ..
Only THEN Martin Luther King's "I HAVE A DREAM" will become reality
RE: (The election of the first black guy to the presidency has so freaked out the racists in Dear ol' Dixie, many of them are seeking the repeal of that law. "We'll be good this time", they're saying, "Trust us".)
First, who painted the half black guy all black? Notice no one says the accurate statement: "The election of the first half black, half white guy"? Why not? Answer: The truth won't play to race baiting.
Freaked out dear old Dixie eh? In your WILDEST "southern-prejudiced dreams" Tom! We EXPECTED a REAL ALL BLACK MAN to be elected President! Repeat--we EXPECTED it. And why not....we have MANY BLACKS in public office. When was the last time you lived in dear old Dixie Tom? I have NEWS for you that "dear old Dixie" has grown FASTER and FARTHER from its past than the northern states. We welcome the black man. We treat ALL to southern hospitality. Our generosity and kindness is well known. We learned from our past but its obvious as VICTOR resident of the north---you learned nothing. Only in LOSS can one learn--and we did. Perhaps YOUR part of the country should learn from us how to treat all people with respect. The only prejudiced people are people who still think the south is some backwards part of the world to be laughed at by elitists who want to prescribe for us medicine they wouldn't take for themselves. Tell me Tom...why do the northern so-called-progressive's depict the poor white proud southern people in pictures of poor white people in suspenders and T shirts and old cars along with statements about politics? Would they make fun of poor people in the inner city so?
All such young world views. I was sent to Selma, Al. In June of 1963. Small, place, blink an eye and you miss it. Sleepy, slow, hot. In front of the Rotary and Civitan club signs welcoming you to town, was the KKK sign.
I watched the news each evening....wondered where all that noise and such was coming from. I had worked all day, ate in a black restaurant....cornbread and yams...and it seemed pretty same, same to me
I had home help. She liked that man, Walllace...thought he had done a lot for her people. I tried to tell her no, he didnt. She wasn't having any of that. She was 65.
Then some damn yankees...her words...came to town...had the nerve to tell her to go home. She replied she was home, they should go home. She went to jail. Called me. She blamed it on all those men..who did not belong there. Living history is a lot different than reading about it.
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