Monday, June 20, 2011

Privatize Me

If the right wing have their way the word "Public" will no longer be a part of our national vocabulary.

The problem with the elitist mentality of the plutocracy which is seeking to destroy anything concerned with "public works" is that they just can't stomach the fact that we all own a piece the American infrastructure. That is what Benjamin Franklin was thinking when he founded the first public library. He didn't claim it for himself. He didn't charge admission or a rental fee for the privilege of obtaining knowledge from the use of the books contained within. He understood that true freedom meant access - and that access is diminishing with each passing year. The corporations want it ALL for themselves. At this writing it looks as if they might have their way.

I'm not implying that it would be boring living in a corporate-owned police state. They would certainly have enough things out there to distract us, that's for sure. Imagine if every news outlet in the nation were replicas of FOX Noise, the New York Post or
the "Excellence" in Broadcasting Radio Network (Rush Limbaugh's outfit). While nothing read in print or heard over the airwaves would be a source of reliable or useful information, it sure as hell would be amusing - in a perverted sort of way,

The fact i
s, a thousand Sean Hannity clones coming at us from every direction, force-feeding us - not what we need to know, but what they want us to believe - would be the basis of some really heavy-duty satire. Come to think about it, it's already been done. Kurt Vonnegut went down this dark road fifty years ago in 1961, in a short story called, Harrison Bergeron. Look it up. It's prophetic.

I miss Kurt Vonnegut.

"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both."

-Louis D. Brandeis

Justice Brandeis died seventeen years before I was born, but I imagine those who are old enough (and smart enough) to remember him, miss him as much as I miss Vonnegut.

The problem with the American people is that most of them are just too heart-breakingly stupid to understand what is happening to them - and I really do appreciate that fact - I really do. This is what makes my job such a delight. Life is beautiful. Thank you, Rupert Murdoch.

Take, for instance, the relatively new concept of the "Prison Industrial Complex" (and what a concept indeed!) That's right, boys and girls, your government is in the process of turning over the prison system to the fucking private sector. If you have yet to be acquainted with the ramifications of this nasty development, allow me to enlighten you if I may:

All of us (or most of us I hope) long for a day when societal ills are forever eradicated, and America's prison population is diminished to a barely perceptible molecule of what is is today. It's a beautiful dream, is it not? You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. But it's a dream that is never going to see the light of day if these people have their way. Why?

Here's why: Corporations are not created in order to fail. In fact their entire reason for existing is to expand. That is what the founders of IBM had in mind when they started that company a-hundred-years-ago this month. They wanted to reach into every facet of American life - and they succeeded beyond anyone's wildest imagination. Just look around you. IBM is everywhere.

By privatizing the American prison system, these assholes have created a brand-spanking-new corporate class whose very existence will depend upon those prisons being filled to the rafters with human beings - FOREVER! As a result, the owners will send lobbyists to Washington, who will then bribe our representatives into passing more-and-more punitive laws that will ensure that those prisons are booked to capacity. How will they make a profit? Forced industrial labor - which will be just another drain on American jobs. Think about that: Forced labor. It's something that was officially terminated in this nation one-hundred and forty-six years ago. It was called "slavery". Remember that "peculiar institution"?

Mah! Mah! The ol' plantation sho has changed!

`Unlike Nixon's phony "war on drugs" which was launched forty-years-ago this past Friday, the targets of the next mass incarceration won't be merely blacks and other minorities. Here's a little prediction you can take to the bank, kids: When the prison industrial complex of the right wing's rancid dreams is finally a universal reality in this dying country, it won't mean a damned difference what your race is - we'll all be Corporate America's niggers then. I've never been a betting man, but this is too good an opportunity to pass up. Would anyone care to make a little wager on that prediction? Any takers? Hmm???

Why is it that most people refuse to understand what an insanely, monstrous idea this is?

And are you ready for the kicker? Not only do these disgusting bastards and bitches want to do away with the Department of Education, they want to privatize the American school system. "Schools for profit". Isn't that a scream? If and when that becomes reality, the generation of kids "educated" under that system won't be educated at all. They'll be indoctrinated. Keep voting Republican.

And how is privatization working out for the commuters of the Indiana Toll Road? Since the uber-nitwit governor, Mitch Daniels, handed it over to a privately-owned, foreign based firm, the cost of traveling that stretch of highway is about to double what it was in 2006, the year it went "private". The contract the state negotiated, by the way, is for seventy-five years. I come from generations of Indianans. I'm quite embarrassed by this turn of events. Seriously.

Or how 'bout the people of Chicago? How's privatization working out for them? Certain parking meters in that city have been handed over to another foreign-based firm. The rates have risen so high that people just can't afford to park there anymore. Commerce in the infected area has suffered demonstrably. That contract lasts for a century. Sweet deal!

This is not merely where we're going, folks, this is where we are. Wake up. Let's get off of our butts! We have one of two choices: to put a stop to this atrocity, or to passively learn to live with it - like lemmings marching off the cliff into the sea; like corporate-controlled robots. I don't think this is what the Founding Fathers had in mind. How's that for understatement?

In the late winter of 1980, I was a student at Orange County Community College in Middletown, NY. One afternoon, my alarmed sociology professor told his all-but clueless class:

"In the years to come this country will move so far to the extreme right, in thirty years you won't even recognize it."

-Dr. William Byrne

At the time I thought he was just a tad paranoid. As it turns out, maybe not. Call it a hunch on my part but I've got a funny feeling that the good doctor might have been onto something.

Wake up and smell the elephant shit.

Tom Degan


Welcome to the Monkey House
A collection of short stories by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.


Keith Olbermann is back this evening at 8:00 on Current TV with a new and improved version of Countdown. Welcome back, Keith. You were missed - sorely.


The Spirit of a Progressive by Peter Fegan:

Happy reading!

For more recent postings on "The Rant", please go here:

"The Rant" by Tom Degan



At 3:20 PM, Blogger Gypsy Bob said...

We PAY cable/Hand Held Device/Credit Card Companies to take information on our likes/dislikes so they can Market back to us the things we think we want. Ladies & Gents that is The Royal Scam...It's the end of the world as we know it!

At 3:50 PM, Blogger Mack Lyons said...

Corporate America and the fundamentalist conservatives are all angling for the same goal as the landed men of the former Confederacy had in mind prior to, during and after the Confederacy's brief existence: for as many poor whites and blacks to be reduced to a neo-feudalist existence at the behest of and for the profit of their landed betters.

In other words, we're all becoming sharecroppers.

When the "stars and bars"-waving sympathizers of the "lost cause" kept declaring "The South shall rise again", I thought they were talking about the Confederacy physically reassembling itself like some rather industrious zombie. No, they were really referring to the spirit of the Confederacy infiltrating and consuming Washington D.C., slowly relying on the landed men of Wall Street to turn as many Americans as possible into sharecroppers and parcel them out amongst the vast holdings of the landed men throughout the nation.

Perhaps "peonage" is a better word to describe what's happening to all of us.

At 3:51 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Tom, the selling-off of America, the abandonment of our working-class, the current assault against our middle-class, and the consolidation and continuance of a permanent-war economy, are all indicators of The Shock Doctrine taking place right here in the "good ole U.S. of A." It's disaster capitalism at its finest moment. We're being attacked -- not from outside our geographical shores, but from within. The corporate and banking elite are deconstructing this nation, piece-by-piece, and most aren't even aware.

It's time to take a stand, and the stand is taking place this October. Please commit that you'll be there. (Otherwise, there soon won't be anything left to stand up for.)

At 4:32 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

I say we use the Patriot Act to round up these capitalist pig terrorists and take back the COMMONS for WE THE PEOPLE.....oh wait a minute it's the capitalist pig terrorists' Patriot Act. Sorry my bad...........

At 4:43 PM, Blogger Catharine said...

Dear Canada,

I'd like to come and live with you now, please.

Thank you.



At 5:20 PM, Anonymous Will Shirley said...

As we scramble about in the darkness, feeling around and bumping into stuff, I just can't escape the feeling that I no longer am all that sure the stuff I bumped into wasn't being moved around in the darkness by people moving swiftly and wearing very quiet clothes. But that would be madness, yes? This "Elephant" has seventeen legs, sixteen trunks, fourteen teeth, a whole lot of lovin' oh yeah, and smells a little bit of peanuts.

I think "sharecropper" is a pretty adequate term. "peonage" is a tad harsh, although more accurate insofar as debt to income and range of incomes, etc. And what's more I think that the "Fringe People", who predated the Hippies by months, had it right when they declared that "Everything should be free!" Because if everybody agreed to believe that money was just a happy token and everything essential to life should be free, Think of all the crimes that won't be committed!

At 6:19 PM, Blogger Rain said...

You describe my fear and it's only paranoia if it's not happening or possible!

At 8:37 PM, Blogger charles moore said...

Tom, regarding the Chicago parking meter fiasco, not only have parking rates become astronomical, but the city is loosing money on the deal; big time. And former mayor Daley wanted to privatize even more city departments.

At 9:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Charles Moore,

Please support your statement that Chicago is loosing money on the deal, big time on parking meters.

At 9:56 PM, Blogger Peter Fegan said...

I am always amused whenever I hear a conservative quote one of the founding fathers out of context to prove one of their points. Fact is that the majority of the founders were nothing like what the Right portray them as.

The quote by Brandeis is spot on. Pity most of the people who need to hear it won't.

Peter Fegan

At 2:53 AM, Blogger Mack Lyons said...

Here ya go, Anonymous:

"New information reveals that Chicago will lose more parking meter revenue than the $2 to $4 billion Alderman Scott Waguespack (32nd) and Inspector General Joseph M. Ferguson initially estimated. Bloomberg News reported Chicago Parking Meters LLC (CPM), which is owned primarily by Morgan Stanley, estimates that it will earn over $9.58 billion dollars from its parking meter deal with the city. CPM’s $9.58 billion revenue is more than eight times what CPM paid Chicago for the parking meter rights.."

...for example, if Chicago kept the parking meters, Alderman Scott Waguespack pegged Chicago’s parking meter revenue at $4 or $5 billion, which is $3 to $4 billion more than the $1.16 Chicago received from CPM."

At 8:09 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sounds to me that liberal Chicago democrats don't know how to make a good business deal. Not surprised.

At 9:25 AM, Blogger Teeluck said...

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me...Martin Niemöller

Soon we won't be free anymore, with the Screwus (scotus) on one side and the corporations (citizens united)on the other side...we will be crushed in the middle.

At 9:25 AM, Blogger Suzan said...

I miss both of them.

And my country.

At 1:33 PM, Anonymous Hester Prynne said...

I miss Kurt Vonnegut too. He said when the first H.W. war started that it was the beginning of the next great depression. No one listened and here we are. We live in the "land of opportunity" has anyone seen one of those lately? No jobs,no money and no one seems to care, or even understand that we are being raped by corporations and our corporate government. The leader who promised us change is a liar. There are no consequences for these politicians who can stay where they are and enjoy healthcare no other hard working american has access to unless they are employed by the government. How did we get here? We turned over the financing of elections to the wealthy, who made it harder for unions to organize. We deregulated the banks and let them off scot free when they screwed the global economy. No one in power questions corporate power. Because the are all sleeping together. Vonnegut saw what was coming and guess what? he was just an artist (just?) I am an artist too, and an art teacher who can't find a job. No one wants to teach kids art or music anymore because it doesn't make money, not like finance does! We will not have any Kurt Vonneguts anymore if we don't change things. God I hope the idiotocracy wakes up, instead I guess they'll just become slave labor in our lovely privataized workhouses, vis a vis Dickens.

At 3:17 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

The prison industrial scam is just the half of it. We shouldn't expect them to stop with privatized prisons. Law enforcement will be privatized as well.

As the Hurricane Katrina response was organized, Blackwater moved in.

Accountable community/public law enforcement will be defunded and replaced by unaccountable Blackwater/Xe mercenaries patroling our streets. They will be paid for the amount of arrests they make, not for public safety.

This is the horror awaiting our children's America if we can't stop it.

This notion should be nothing but paranoid fantasy, but I'm convinced it will come to pass.

At 3:33 PM, Blogger Darlene said...

Now I'm totally depressed. Nero fiddled while Rome burned and Obama golfs with Boehner and Kasich while out country goes down the tubes.

At 3:35 PM, Blogger charles moore said...

Mack Lyons, thank you; you documented the Chicago parking meter fiasco before I got around to it.

I find it interesting that all of the various conservative anonymous writers always ask for documentation while they just choose to blow statements out of their ass.

At 3:38 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Private police wouldn't be subject to what remains of our Constitutional rights ?? Illegal search ?? Sorry, NO STATE ACTION !!! Go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200 !! As Robert Hunter said " When you learn the rules they change the game. " Put a fork in civil rights...they're done.

At 6:30 PM, Anonymous Juast the Facts! said...

Gee, this wasnt supposed to happen!
(Reuters) — PricewaterhouseCoopers (PWC) recently released its annual report on medical cost trends for 2012, and it is revealing.

1) The report shows health care costs and premiums continuing to rise-and uncertainty increasing for employers who offer insurance to their workers. Health care spending increased by 7.5 percent in 2010 and will grow by 8 percent this year.

2) In 2012, it will rise again by 8.5 percent. This is exactly the opposite of the President’s promise that his health care plan would reduce premiums by $2,500 per person.

3) Perhaps most concerning are the findings of a survey also released by PWC divulging how employers are likely to react to Obamacare. The survey showed that nearly half of employers will drop their coverage, dumping employees into the government-run exchanges.

At 7:50 PM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Juast the Facts!, compare and contrast your copy & paste with...
In 2004, employer-sponsored health insurance premiums grew 11.2% to $9950 for family coverage, and $3695, according to a survey by the Kaiser Family Foundation and Health Research and Education Trust. The survey also found that 61% of workers were receiving employer sponsored health insurance. ...From 1999 to 2009, Kaiser found that the insurance premiums had climbed 131% or 13.1% per year, and workers’ contribution toward paying that premium jumped 128% or 12.8% per year. (emphasis mine)

At 7:53 PM, Anonymous Just the Facts! said...

MOE, got any more info you care to share with us about "sneaky lazy Negroes" like you did earlier?

At 8:25 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Anybody ever notice when a Rightie's point gets demolished, they quickly change the subject?

At 8:31 PM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Just the Facts!, yes, I did, but kudos on your continued uselessness.

Dave Dubya, it's an odd tactic, him arguing for Single Payer like that.

At 8:36 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Juast the Facts! [sic], you wrote...

"Gee, this wasnt [sic] supposed to happen!"

So, exactly what was it that wasn't supposed to happen?

JTF! (aka "Anonymous"), I'm really surprised that conservatives like yourself haven't latched on to the new heath care law and claimed it as your own. I mean, after all, it's going to be a big payday for the private insurers. Isn't that what you want? (Have you even bothered to read the law?)

Oh, by the way, I love how Modusoperandi continually trumps you! It's really hilarious! It's fun to see conservatives eat crow, than frantically attempt to spit it out by changing subjects. Nothing gives me more pleasure. :-)

P.S. I'm still waiting...

At 9:30 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

I'll correct my own error...

That's "then frantically attempt to spit it out..."

Anonymous, I'm still waiting...

At 11:19 PM, Anonymous Just the Facts! said...

Let's talk about something that hasn't been settled, and that's MOE stating that "Negroes are lazy and sneaky".
No one upset? Ever notice how liberals can never be racist, they can only claim conservatives are.

P.S. MOE, what does your report starting in 2004 and ending in 2010 have to do with this fact "In 2012, it (cost of healthcare) will rise again by 8.5 percent. This is exactly the opposite of the President’s promise that his health care plan would reduce premiums by $2,500 per person."
JG what do you think was supposed to happen?

At 11:45 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

If I may be not-so-intrusive as to change the subject, as some others do, allow me to switch back to the original topic.

The Republicans love to get elected in order to prove government doesn't work. Then they give the public service functions of government away to private interests. This is crony capitalism to the extreme. It is a Republican-enabled corporate coup of our government. We all know they work for the interests of Big Money exclusively, to consolidate the power and redistribute wealth to the economic elite. They are as hostile towards democracy as Communist China is.

Republican “con-servatism” is our democracy's greatest adversary, and it is winning. If just ten percent more Americans understood the Republican class war waged against them on behalf of the economic elites, we could be a free democracy.

At 1:24 AM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Just the Facts, you didn't read the previous link* did you? Kudos on your continued uselessness.

"This is exactly the opposite of the President’s promise that his health care plan would reduce premiums by $2,500 per person."
So you can't even wait until all the pieces of the ACA are in effect before knocking it down? Do you go to the pits at the racetrack before the race and chide them for not currently moving at top speed? Do you watch the news and call them to complain halfway through the lotto, because they "...didn't draw enough numbers"?

* Or the one before that. Or the one before that. Or the text before the link. Or the text after it. Or...

At 3:50 AM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Modusoperandi, as I said on Tom's previous post, most conservatives (in particular, Just the Facts!) speak and read in monosyllabic words only. For him, your answer was incomprehensible, as if you were speaking a foreign language.

That's half the battle.

At 5:38 AM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Jefferson's Guardian, to be fair I do speak real smartly.

And to be honest, I'm pondering the possibility that he's an expert program. Sort of like a modern ELIZA, but programmed by greed, Tribalism and sociopathy instead of nerds, dorks and geeks.
Granted, I should also note that I'm pretty sure that Rush Limbaugh is animatronic.

At 7:18 AM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Modusoperandi, you said...

" be fair I do speak real smartly."

Undoubtedly. There's no question about that.

and you mentioned...

"I'm pondering the possibility that he's an expert program."

Now you have me thinking about that possibility, also.

At 1:32 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

I heard this guy for the first time on the radio the other day while scanning channels. I looked him up on the net and found this debate. This is a great debate between people left and right leaning views. I think EEsq will appreciate this.

BTW, Ben Franklin didn't believe in debt and certainly wouldn't endorse public sector unions.

At 1:45 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

Your criticism of other's grammar, spelling, word selection and sentence structure is an obvious crutch that highlights your inability to otherwise put forth cogent argument.

At 2:45 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Boltok, you said (referring to the YouTube video)...

"This is a great debate between people left and right leaning views."

In one of the few times I've viewed something you've suggested (and you know why -- no hyperlinks! C'mon, you claim to be an economist -- learn some basic HTML!), I'm totally amazed that you thought this was "a great debate". Nonsense! It was obviously a phoney caller, reminiscent of the weakly Alan Colmes' liberal views on Hannity & Colmes. He was the straw man, just as the caller was in the video. That joker's radio show is fraudulent -- just as most right-wing media are.

As far as my criticism of a certain person's English language comprehension skills, the crutch is actually borne by him (and others like him). It's obvious that person's comprehension skills are remedial in many areas, which as observed by another commenter, makes it almost impossible to have a debate with him in good faith.

I've asked in the past whether English was a second language for you, but you ignored my question. If that's the case -- that English is not your native tongue -- it's understandable.

At 3:44 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Boltok, I have an observation to make, and then I want to ask you a few questions. You've just joined the discussion concerning the privatizing of the public sector, yet you chimed in with some bogus story about lefty versus right-wing debate. Please explain the connection (if you can).

Why do you, and your kind, constantly divert the conversation? Why didn't you, instead, make a relevant comment concerning the topic of the post? I'm pretty sure I know the answer, but I want to see your feeble attempt to defend yourself.

Oh, and by the way, here's another fine article regarding privatization of the commons and what the conservative movement (and corporatist movement) is all about. The deconstruction and purposeful bankrupting of America is in full swing.

At 5:06 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The deconstruction and purposeful bankrupting of America is in full swing."

Yup, it sure is, and it's happening under the most liberal, socialist President in our history. Maybe you should start screaming at him instead of at conservatives.

At 5:14 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Thanks for the article. We see it concludes with my point of an imminent corporatist police state...
"Remember, more and more national security and police services are being outsourced to the private sector"

Man the brainwashing is effective when someone concludes Obama is a liberal socialist. As if he never pandered to Wall Street, or telecoms, or Insurance companies, or etc. etc....

I suppose from the fascist point of view, though, Obama is a leftist. Orwell was right about totalitarianism. Ignorance is strength.

At 5:47 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

I don't have a problem with public assets. I do have a problem with overstaffed, over paid, over benefited and over pensioned union workers bankrupting all levels of government. Privatization is a means of lower costs for the tax paying slaves, in some cases.

I cannot make a blanket judgment about the sale of public assets. I probably would not sell public assets but would opt to privatize workforces wherever possible. If the privatized service employees underperform, they and their employers can be fired and replaced. Try that with a public employee and see what happens.

Why do think that was a bogus caller? How does his view differ from most on this blog?

You should listed to yourself. You are the grammar and spelling police.

TD bitching about IBM? IBM is an innovative company that provided a great many useful technologies to the world including the machine he uses to write nonsense.

At 10:55 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dave Dubya, JG so who would you rather have as our President/

At 11:04 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Has anybody else also noticed when Righties’ points are demolished, they change the subject and steer the discussion in circles?

And as I answered the first time, "Someone more of a progressive/socialist Nixon".

At 11:05 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

JG who would your choice be?

At 8:12 AM, Anonymous Modusoperandi said...

Anonymous: Bernie Sanders (so liberal that he's not even a Democrat. Also, he's cursed with a virtually Naderesque miasma* of whatever the opposite of charisma is), Al Franken (he's quick-witted and did pretty well defending healthcare reform, even when [especially when!] surrounded by protesters who enjoyed drinking tea while at parties) or Sherrod Brown (scrappy).

* Voted "Most Awesome Word of the Day" by no one of consequence.

At 8:13 AM, Anonymous Modusoperandi said...

I should note that none of them would stand any chance of getting the nomination, much less winning the election.

At 8:16 AM, Anonymous Modusoperandi said...

And, if we're deep in Dreamland, a Colbert/Stewart ticket would be pretty sweet.

At 9:50 AM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Wouldn't it be great if we the people could actually have a choice for president? Instead, thanks to our corrupted election campaign funding we are only allowed candidates backed by Big Money.

Corporatocracy will destroy democracy unless we have a constitutional change in corporate personhood, establish public funded elections, and restore corporate media's obligations to the public interest in the public owned broadcast spectrum. Campaign ads on TV make corporate media partners in corruption with the corporate politicians.

At 11:05 AM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Dave Dubya, you remarked...

"Corporatocracy will destroy democracy..."

If you don't mind, let me revise your observation: Our corporatocracy has already destroyed democracy. Any democratic processes, that you still perceive, are only seen through a veneer, or shell, of democracy. It's not real. Underneath, the corporatocracy rules and calls the shots. As Joe Bageant said, we live in the "American Hologram". Others, quite accurately, describe most Americans as being colonized in the mind. It's really very true.

At 12:46 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

I agree. The only exception is we still have one last vestige of democracy with ballot initiatives. Medicinal cannabis has been one of the very few victories for the people.

I expect these measures will be strangled by Big Money eventually.

At 1:22 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Not all states have ballot initiatives. Medicinal marijuana laws that states have enacted are ignored by the Feds who appear hell bent on harassing all involved in the process from the growers to the distributors to the medicine using patients. The Feds have even gone as far as to intimidate the Governors of states with medical ( why they like that term instead of medicinal I don't know ) marijuana laws into not signing legislation to license dispensaries or otherwise regulate the industry by telling them that by signing such legislation they will be in violation of Federal law. So much for Obummer's campaign promises, the guy is a lying piece of shit !!

At 2:30 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Dave and Ellis, it looks like only half (twenty-four) of the states have initiative and referendum processes available, and it's predominately a phenomenon in our western and plains states. Being on the other coast, unfortunately mine doesn't.

Modusoperandi, Bernie Sanders would be my pick also. But, you know that will never happen. Well, maybe when hell freezes over...

At 3:55 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"So much for Obummer's campaign promises, the guy is a lying piece of shit !!"
I could have told you that, just based on his work record, or lack of same, in 2008.
You gonna vote for him again in 2012?

At 4:06 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Will you vote for him again in 2012 ?? NO FUCKING WAY !!!! I have decided I will no longer participate in the sham of Amerikan " democracy " until we have public campaign financing only in our elections and take the impact of wealth out of politics !!!

At 7:21 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

You know full well that when the time comes you will proudly march to voting booth and pull the lever for your socialist leader BHO.

At 7:56 PM, Anonymous The Real Jefferson's Guardian said...

There are a lot of cool aid drinkers listening to the phoney Jefferson's Guardian here fer sure! (to the phoney JG please post that "fer" is not a word to prove how anal retentive you are!)

How many here think Social Security is solvent?

How many think the US Postal Service is broke?

Taking off my cool aid socialist glasses, How can government accounting, which is worse then Enron, be taken seriously? It looks to me like there are more crooks in Government than in the private sector! MOE and the phoney JG tell me what you think!

At 9:35 PM, Anonymous Just the Facts! said...

( - Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner told the House Small Business Committee on Wednesday that the Obama administration believes taxes on small business must increase so the administration does not have to “shrink the overall size of government programs.”

Sounds like a great plan!!

Do you supporters of Bernie Sanders, Nixon, Sherrod Brown think your guys would be for this idea coming from the Obama White House?
Do you like this idea, in not, why not?

At 11:26 PM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Just the Facts!, read whole article. Heck, watch the video.
The federal government is an insurance company with an army. Both sides, pretty much, agree that Defense is off the table (I see the GOP as going along with it just long enough to bash the Dems in the next election for being "weak on Defense"). That leaves Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. And revenues.

At 12:27 AM, Anonymous Just the Facts! said...

Moe,you didn't or cant answer the question, AGAIN.
MOE, must be your racism that prevents you from giving a straight answering.

At 12:52 AM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Just the Facts!, you still haven't read my last reply on that page, have you? Or any other link, really. Kudos on your continued uselessness.

At 2:39 AM, Anonymous boltok said...

The Real JG,
The post office is about to go bust. The are tapping their pension system to stay afloat. Taxpayers will bail them out like the GM unions in the end.

Social Security: THE AARP CHANGED POSITION REGARDING THE REORGANIZATION OF SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS. There is no money there but piles of deficit bonds. If the AARP admits the system is broke, that is all the evidence you need that the shit will eventually hit the fan.


At 8:03 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why would you ask MOE about the President, he's a Canadian?

At 12:24 AM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

better than some anonymous bastard

At 4:13 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Shove Your Hate Up Your Asshole, Your shit party is the party of the KKK degan. This is a hate site and your followers are hate, your state and California should fall off the USA to make it a lot better place.

At 5:05 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Anonymous, did you forget to take your medication again?

At 5:21 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

Welcome to Anonymous' Divided States of America!

At 5:42 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

At 5:45 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

The KKK has their own party as seen here and here. They endorse no one at this time, but their white, American Christian values match the Tea Party's more than us heathen's in the Democrat or Other party, and you are full of shit if you try to say otherwise.

At 9:11 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

The KKK are a Democratic organization. They have nothing to do with the Tea Party.

At 9:28 PM, Blogger De_Bill said...

You would have to truly be an idiot or braindead to think the Ku Klux Klan is a "Democratic" organization today.
After the Civil War and until the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voter's Rights Act of 1965 were signed, the South was largely Democratic because the GOP was 'the party of Lincoln', but that was changed in 1964, and the GOP capitalized on that white southern disaffection with the Democratic party with its 'southern strategy' in the second half of the 60s.

At 9:28 PM, Anonymous Just the Facts! said...

The late Senator Byrd (D) of WEST VIRGINA was a Grand Dragon in the KKK.

There is no record of the late Senator Byrd ever being a member of the Tea Party or attending a Tea Party meeting.
Something that can not be said about his relationship with the KKK

At 10:46 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

The late Senator Byrd (D) of WEST VIRGINA was a Grand Dragon in the KKK
Key word was.
Your shit party is the party of the KKK degan.
Key word is.

Boltok you said The KKK are a Democratic organization. Did you read either of my links?
The key word from your bullshit statement is are.

You guys are so full of shit.

At 10:49 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

@ De_Bill - Your concept of historical fact shows a clear and "well known liberal bias."

At 11:05 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

You would have to truly be an idiot or braindead to use wikipedia as your source to prove that the KKK is a Democratic Organization

At 11:13 PM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Just the Facts! "The late Senator Byrd (D) of WEST VIRGINA was a Grand Dragon..."
He was an Exalted Cyclops. Who "presides over the Council of the Centaurs". And "....and writes quarterly reports to the Grand Giant". Which sounds hi-friggin-larious.

" the KKK."
A white southern Democrat in the Klan? In the 1940's?! Say it ain't so!

"There is no record of the late Senator Byrd ever being a member of the Tea Party or attending a Tea Party meeting."
Why would he? He wasn't a Republican.

"Something that can not be said about his relationship with the KKK"
You mean the organization he abandoned?
What next, are you going to hide in Strom Thurmond's old house and throw stones at us? Or does that not fit the narrative, where the parties are what the parties were, you've chosen?

At 11:13 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

@ Dumb-ass Boltok - Check your sources before you use them - From the very 1st paragraph of KKK wikipedia link that YOU posted

Ku Klux Klan, often abbreviated KKK and informally known as The Klan, is the name of three distinct past and present far-right organizations in the United States, which have advocated extremist reactionary currents such as white supremacy, white nationalism, and anti-immigration, historically expressed through terrorism. Since the mid-20th century, the KKK has also been anti-communist. The current manifestation is splintered into several chapters and is classified as a hate group.

hmmm Far-Right and anti-communist sounds very very LIBERAL and DEMOCRATIC to me.

Now kindly crawl back under the bridge you trudged out from.

At 7:59 AM, Anonymous boltok said...

Wiki is a liberal edited source, but useful nonetheless.

If you read a little deeper you would have noticed the strong democratic, anti republican, anti catholic history of the KKK. That seems very much like the liberals of today.

The Democrat strategy is to claim that all bigoted Dems are Republicans.

For an additional data point on liberal bigotry, Margaret Sanger loved people of color.

At 11:45 AM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

The Democrat strategy is to claim that all bigoted Dems are Republicans.

This is classic. It contains radical Right projection wrapped in an outrageous lie.

The only bigotry from the Left is for radical Right, democracy-hating, fascistic greedheads...and their appeasers, dupes, and henchmen.

I don't know any Republicans who share our form of bigotry.

At 11:55 AM, Anonymous Just the Facts! said...

"What next, are you going to hide in Strom Thurmond's old house and throw stones at us?"

Who is us? For some one who calls blacks "sneaky, lazy Negroes", just wondering how a Canadian racist fits into this argument. By the way, you had a chance yet to visit Vancouver and fix up the mess your fellow anarchists made there?

At 12:40 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

You are truly a stupid man. You don't even know the history of your creed.

At 12:57 PM, Blogger Modusoperandi said...

Just the Facts!, have you still not read my last reply there, have you continued to not read for comprehension, etc? Kudos on your continued uselessness.

At 1:23 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

As FDR boldly asserted, "I welcome their hatred".

Since the hateful accusation is coming from you, I'll take that as a compliment.

I must have struck a nerve.

Thank you.

At 1:43 PM, Anonymous Just the Facts! said...

I know MOE I'm just a stupid dumbass who cant read or write, like most republicans.

At 1:53 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

@ Boltok - once again the argument was NEVER the history, it was the present!

I know literacy is not your strong suit, but please stay with us.

At 1:57 PM, Anonymous Lurker said...

I know MOE I'm just a stupid dumbass who cant read or write, like most republicans.

You said it, Bravo!

At 4:03 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

DD and MM
No nerve struck. I think it is important for Democrats to understand and accept the vile history of their party. The KKK was a Democratic party to the core. There is an immense amount of obvious and subtle bigotry on the left. You just feel better projecting the negative aspect of your party on others. Keep it up if it makes you happy.

At 4:46 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

You just feel better projecting the negative aspect of your party on others.

Aww, isn't it cute? More projection, although completely misdirected. I'm certainly no Democrat. I'm an advocate of democracy, not the Democratic Party, who are almost as subservient to corporate Big Money as Republicans.

As we all know, corporatist Republicanism is antithetical to all vestiges of democracy.

Likewise is the American radical Right opposed to democracy, in favor of plutocracy by the economic elites.

They are Golden Rulers. They want those with the gold to rule.

The choice is simple. Corporatist Republicanism or democracy. We cannot have both.

Speaking of history, authoritarian conservatism has always opposed every effort towards democracy, equality, freedom, and prosperity for minorities and the working class. Slavery, poll taxes, “literacy” tests for minorities, voter disenfranchisement, purging of rolls, minimum wage, the war on drugs, warrantless surveillance, torture, etc. are all hallmarks of the Right Wing authoritarian conservatives.

This is why they must adopt the same smear tactics of the fascists of last century Europe. They need to accuse all opposition of being anti-American communists to make them scapegoats for all that is wrong with the nation.

And who has had all the wealth and political power over the past three decades? That's Right! But nothing is their fault, you know, for, "ve must blame ze, liberal commies, for everyzing!"

History is repeating. Fascism is on the rise, and the American Fourth Reich is gaining power.

At 5:05 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Dave, everything you said is right in the very center of the bulls-eye. You couldn't possibly be more accurate.

Boltok, you, however, are shooting arrows in the opposite direction. Where do you come up with such horseshit? There's absolutely no validity within any of your statements. It's almost as if you believe what you say. Unbelievable!

At 6:26 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

Was the KKK comprised of Democrats?
Did Margaret Sanger ever speak about something called the Negro Project?

Answer no to both of those questions and we will know is horseshit.

I understand that you don't want to admit that your party, and by extension you, have endorsed such behavior. I wouldn't want to admit it either if I were guilty.

At 6:51 PM, Anonymous Modusoperandi said...

Jefferson's Guardian, I hate to sort of agree with Boltok, but in among his attempting to smear the present with the past, there is a point.
Look at the history of the USA by location and not by party and it makes more sense. While the Dems appeared on both sides of the line, in the South (where Republicans made little headway), they were the party of white resentment (even they could see that slavery, the "peculiar institution", was on the wane, and could not survive without westward expansion). And the North was no Utopia for African-Americans, either.
Aaaand with the Civil War, the stage was set for shifting alignments that lead to the present (from the Lily White Movment within the Republican party, to Truman's EO 9981, LBJ in '64, Dixiecrat defection, Nixon, etc).
Heck, look at the results of the presidential election of 1860, with Lincoln's Republicans being distinctly a Northern party, and, after a split over...wait for it...slavery, two Democratic parties; the pro-slavery one winning...wait for it...the South.
The parties are not what the parties were. A hundred and fifty years after the Civil War, however, the North and the South remain.

At 7:00 PM, Anonymous Bob Elkins said...

The Chicago Skyway--all 7 1/2 miles of it was leased for 99 years for a one-time 1.5 Billion. It is a direct connection to the Indiana Tollroad. Rahm Emmanuel is trying to void the contract. It ain't working out so good.

At 8:58 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

Boltok -Once again, no one is arguing the past, and you need to fire your fact checker. I do not ever remember JG claiming to be a member of the Democratic Party.

At 9:09 PM, Anonymous Hester Prynne said...

There you go again Modusoperandi you Canadian racist, trying to act all high and mighty by telling us about our history, while not dealing with your own heart that hates "Negroes".
Example, as cleary shown by your calling Blacks, "sneaky, lazy Negroes". Crawl back to your hole under your igloo, we wont stand racism like yours on this blog!

At 9:30 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Boltok, as Mary pointed out, when did I ever claim to be a Democrat? If anything, I'm an anti-corporatist, no matter which party they call their own.

Modusoperandi, I agree with you, however my agreement with Dave D. was in regard to his last comment (time-stamp 4:46 p.m.); not in relation to the roots and history of the Klan. Nevertheless, Boltok's argument is a non sequitur. It has no relevance to what's going on today.

At 10:07 PM, Anonymous Modusoperandi said...

Hester Prynne "There you go again Modusoperandi you Canadian racist, trying to act all high and mighty by telling us about our history…"
Obviously. Mentioning and citing actual history is "trying to act all high and mighty".

"...while not dealing with your own heart that hates 'Negroes'. Example, as cleary shown by your calling Blacks, 'sneaky, lazy Negroes'."
Allow me to quote from the post (that you still have not read) on the page (that you have not read, in the very least, for comprehension), "You're still missing the important detail. It's not my timeline. It's not my word. It's yours."
Again, again, (again,) Anonymous/Just the Facts!/Hester Prynne, kudos on your continued (what is now a multiplicity) of uselessness.

Jefferson's Guardian "Nevertheless, Boltok's argument is a non sequitur."
From Boltok? I'm shocked! Shocked, I say! Tu quoque, sure, but non sequitur?! Madness!

At 6:29 AM, Anonymous boltok said...

MM and JJ
In the next election, where may I find the anti-corporation candidates on the ballot? So, absent this category, who do you vote for? Answer, Democrats 100% of the time (I concede that you would probably vote for a Socialist). That makes you one of them.

Please don't tell me you don't vote Democrat. I don't want to laugh my coffee all over my desk.

At 12:36 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Boltok, you wrote...

"In the next election, where may I find the anti-corporation candidates on the ballot?"

First, let me correct you. It's "anti-corporatist", not "anti-corporation". There's a markedly huge difference. I realize your comprehension of the English language is probably not as great as that of native speakers, so it may be necessary to point out that there is a difference. Look it up! Maybe you'll learn something today!

By the way, Sheldon Wolin coined the phrase "inverted totalitarianism", which describes the United States structure of corporatism even more accurately.

Secondly, you're wrong. The Green Party platform includes a provision against corporate personhood. So, by default, any Green Party candidate also is anti-corporatist.

As far as my presidential voting pattern, except for the last menagerie, I've always voted third party -- well, always since 1972. I even voted for Ross Perot (1992), so you can see I'm independent in my voting patterns.

So, once again you're wrong in your assessment. I guess you better get some paper towels. Coffee does stain.

At 1:41 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

based on your voting record with 3rd party's, I guess you could be called a loser.

At 2:10 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Democrat, Republican, Green Party.....until one of the choices on the ballot is a vote to abolish our evil capitalist sham democracy all the choices lead to the same greed driven corporatist plutocracy. Relying on elected officials to effectuate change is a losing proposition. They don't represent WE THE PEOPLE they represent the corporate interests only. We are on our own folks and any change will have come from WE THE PEOPLE not the corporate hacks who pretend to represent WE THE PEOPLE. When a government becomes as broken as Amerika's it should be abolished and replaced with a true democracy with absolute fundamental rights and should be a resource based economy that should have as few rules as possible...that's what LIBERTY is all about !!!

At 2:34 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Anonymous, you claimed...

"JG, based on your voting record with 3rd party's, I guess you could be called a loser."

No, I'm more inclined to think that nowadays, any time you vote for either a Republican or a Democrat, we're all losers.

After eight years of Bush II, and almost three of Obama, you haven't figured that out yet?

You're not paying attention!

At 3:35 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Ellis D,
To paraphrase:
"The future's here. We are it. We are on our own."

At 3:56 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Dave Dubya......Ashes,ashes all fall man in his summer home singing just leave well enough alone, but his pants are down, his cover is blown......ashes, ashes all fall down !! To quote Bob Weir " the whole fucking government is throwing stones !! " From Furthur @ Coney Island, Summer 2010 !! Hey Bobby...didn't you guys endorse Obummer ???

At 4:39 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

"Fooled me once shame on you! You can't get fooled again." (Anonymous,let's say)

Obama the company man president will not get the support Obama the hope and change candidate did.

At 4:50 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"a resource based economy that should have as few rules as possible."

Interesting concept, can you direct me to country that operates like that now?

At 4:59 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said... country has ever been ENLIGHTENED enough to try it. Hippies do well with the concept though... on a smaller scale !!

At 8:00 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

@ Boltok - I am not a registered Democrat, and have never registered that way. I have ALWAYS been an INDEPENDENT (which makes EVERY SINGLE POLITICAL SOLICITOR COME TO MY HOUSE COME CAMPAIGN TIME) and I vote against the big-business republicans in almost every election. When I lived in Texas, I voted Green or Labor or whatever third party candidate I felt like voting for, sometimes I voted Democratically. In 2000 and 2004, I voted for Nader. In 2004 my vote didn't count because it was an absentee ballot that I filled out on deployment, and after I was done filling it out and sealed the ballot, I read in tiny, fine print, no where near the instructions, that it had to be filled out in pencil. I had filled it out in pen. TOO LATE. Pencils are hard to come by on a ship. I voted against the republicans in the last election; I was thrilled because it was my first time voting in CO and my vote would actually count, unlike in TEXAS, so I MADE it count and voted for Obama. I vote strategically, and I plan on keeping it that way. This does not make me a democrat. I can caucus for whoever the hell I want to in the primaries. My vote, my business. I'm a libertarian. Now kiss my ass.

At 8:07 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Hippies do well with the concept though.."
Where can one go to see the hippies in action with this concept?

At 8:12 PM, Anonymous boltok said...

You did mention something that literally burns my ass. This whole concept of military voting like absentees is total bs. I have a number of family members and friends who have served in the military and a cousin in one of the academies. As far as I am concerned they should vote first and their votes should count double.

BTW: I really don't want to kiss your ass. I am sure you could get some takers on this blog. I bet MO would like to kiss your ass.

At 8:41 PM, Anonymous Modusoperandi said...

Lies! I would like to kiss her all over.

At 9:16 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Anonymous, you said...

"Interesting concept [a resource based economy], can you direct me to country that operates like that now?"

Not now, but the people of the Six Nations (Iroquois Confederacy) operated as one for hundreds of years. Until, that is, European encroachment and occupation obliterated their society. Their RBE was a very successful way to live. It was sustainable and in harmony with nature. It worked -- much better than the predatory capitalism that's practiced today. Much of our founders ideas for the Articles of Confederation, and later the Constitution, were borrowed from this once great society.

At 9:24 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

Anonymous - Get off your ass and go to CA, AZ, CO; pretty much anywhere in the west to find hippies living in resource based economies... You won't likely find it on google.

Research the Venus Project and The Zeitgeist Movement ...

Anonymous: "Like OMG! People can co-exist without money?!!

Every rational human being over the age of 10: "Yes they can...and they don't all turn into Mansons..."

Anonymous: "Wow. That is like ....amazing. So how do buy...the newest version of Halo when it comes out?"

Every rational human "..." : {shoots themselves in the face}

At 3:55 AM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Boltok, in response to Mary, you said...

"As far as I am concerned they [members of the military] should vote first and their votes should count double."

They already do! It's called the military-industrial-complex. As a matter of fact, because of Citizens United, their votes are leveraged by billions!

At 7:55 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

JG what was the average life expectancy of members of the Iroquois Confederacy before the Europeans?

At 9:55 AM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Anonymous....unfortunately to avoid persecution the scene you wish to observe has been forced underground. We can't even find each other easily anymore !! JG's reference to Native American Indians is spot on though. Most of our concepts derive from such cultures, ones that place value on nature and live as ego-less an existence as possible with altruism the foremost concern. Get the people fed and some shelter from the storm. As to that question about life expectancy....I'd rather live 30 or 40 yrs free than 70 or 80 years as a puppet/slave. Anyhow, outside of the super-wealthy life expectancy in Amerika will steadily decline as the quality of life continues to deteriorate for the majority of us.

At 12:22 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

So who is stopping you DD and EE from living like Native Americans did before the Europeans came to North America?
No one!
But just as you have that freedom I have the same freedom to not live my life as if it were 1492.

At 12:42 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said... you would rather live your life like it's 1984 ?? Another good farm animal !!!

At 12:53 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Oh, to have a simple mind and narrow view. If we think real, real hard, we might just figure out what stopped American Indians "from living like Native Americans did before the Europeans came to North America."

1984 is a fitting place for the "ignorance is strength" crowd.

At 1:00 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Dave D. Oh the wind blows cold in the land of the Navajo.....

At 3:09 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Yes, especially if you're old and in the way.

At 3:11 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

DD and EE, look assholes, no one said you couldn't live like it was 1492, no one at all. But at the same time, you do not have the right to prevent me from living as I wish. Regardless if my choice is 1984, 1884 or 2011.
So in the words of MM, "Get off your ass and go to CA, AZ, CO; pretty much anywhere in the west to find hippies living in resource based economies."
Who is stopping you?
And for your DD, re READ MY POST, I did not say "what stopped the Natives of North American from living the way they wanted", what I said was "So who is stopping YOU DD and EE from living like Native Americans did before the Europeans came to North America?"

At 3:25 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Anonymous.....we live and let live. Your people are the ones who feel the need to control and manipulate others. The only thing your people are good at is hypocrisy and let me tell you they have mastered it. They have done a fine job of making Amerikans look stupid to the rest of the world. Now they are trying to live up to that stupidity and once again are doing a fine job !!!

At 3:41 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

Wow! Did you see how far my point flew over Anon's head?

I will try to make it simpler for a cult brain.

American government and corporate land rapists make it impossible for Indians, and hippies, to live like before White invasion.

Darn, I couldn't say it without using three syllable words.

Oh, well, I tried.

At 3:43 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

EE, how the fuck do you get that out of my post? I simply said live and let live, your the asshole who has a problem with my living the way I want to. You liberal control freak!
I could give a rat's ass how you live as long as it doesn't interfere with me! Live a life style that reduces your life expectancy to 45 years, I really don't care. Be a vegan, I don't care, smoke dope until your eyes never look open, I really really don't care. Just leave me and my dreams alone, don't ask anything of me, any help, or funds to live your way, and I'll expect the same from you. Deal?

At 3:54 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...


You are full of self righteous bullshit!

MM said "Get off your ass and go to CA, AZ, CO; pretty much anywhere in the west to find hippies living in resource based economies..."
What if the rest of the world doesn't want to live like you? How is any one preventing you from living the way you want? MM found places for you to live if your willing to move?
Take Tom and MM for examples of people making something better out of something that was bad.
It's too hard? Tough shit, if they can do so can you!
So you really think if Europeans had not come to North America, the Natives here would still be living as if it were pre 1492?
Roll another joint and wallow in your self pity, just leave me and my dreams alone.

At 4:06 PM, Blogger Dave Dubya said...

My, my. Here comes the anger.

"...just leave me and my dreams alone."

No worries there. Nothing can wake you up.

At 4:10 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Anonymous.....DEAL !! Now get the rest of the establishment to adhere to it. Good luck !!! BTW...the toll on the Earth from living your way will shorten everyone's life can run but you just can't hide from it.

At 4:11 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Talk about dreams, you wish it was still 1400, now that's a fucking wet dream!
What are you gonna do about your dreams, cry cause it's too hard to make it on your own cause you might have get sober for a while?
Talk to Tom and MM, they have dreams and they are working towards making theirs come true. What about you Dave, how are you working to make your dreams come true? Don't think you can do it, then move.

At 4:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sure, it will, like down to 40 years of age, the ave age a Native American expected to live, sure that's right, yeah big problem gonna happen tomorrow, sure.

You got your deal! Go the fuck and live in a tepee or mud hut and the first fucking thing you need to do is to throw away your computer, since you want this deal. If your "making it real" then we should not be blessed with your shit for brains thoughts as your return to you "simple life". Then get used to using herbs and tree bark for your RX's for your sickness, that's the ultimate free health care, so grab it now. Did a hole near where you live for your toilet and wipe your ass with pine cones, but be sure your hole in the ground doesn't effect the water you drink.
You got that deal big guy, let me live mine and I'll let you live yours.
If you post again here, it means you didn't get rid of your computer and still are living the evil life of modern times, so you really didn't mean it when you said you wanted live like it was before 1492. Guess we will see if you post again how true to your cause you really are.

At 4:28 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Now get the rest of the establishment to adhere to it. "
what do they have to do with your living the way you want to? MM gave you some ideas where you could move to live your way and the 'establishment" isn't gonna stop you if you want it bad enough.
Isn't it the real truth is you want EVERYBODY TO HAVE TO LIVE LIKE IT WAS PRE 1492, LIKE YOU WANT THEM TO? Tell that to MM that she must return to being a squaw, drop out f school, chew buffalo hide to make it soft enough for her to make it into robes and see far that gets you.
OPPS, forgot you cant answer any more, you have removed yourself from the grid, no more computer, right?

At 4:36 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Anonymous....if I was only concerned about myself I would have been gone long ago. I stick around to try to help others not as fortunate as myself. BTW....more cures for illness are found in nature than western man wishes to acknowledge. These remedies have little or no side effects and are inexpensive to produce if not free. Big pharma loves to over charge folks for " medicine " that causes more problems than it solves and keeps the MEDICAL INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX busy with suckers um I mean patients while filling its coffers with ill gotten gains ( no pun intended ).

At 4:57 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

EE, said
"if I was only concerned about myself I would have been gone long ago. I stick around to try to help others not as fortunate as myself. BTW....more cures for illness are found in nature than western man wishes to acknowledge. These remedies have little or no side effects and are inexpensive to produce if not free."

I believe that like I believe the moon is made of cheese. What an air head, would have long ago but was too worried about my fellow man.
Well just take those who want to the fuck go with you and see how long they want to live on your world of pre 1492 conditions, you seem to be "fortunate" enough to do so. Who is stopping you MR. MONEY BAGS?
HEY, BY THE WAY, guess leaving 2011 and your computer behind for 1491 doesn't sound so great after all, or we would have not gotten another one of your pity me posts.
Typical two faced liberal, wants to save the world by making others do what he thinks is best for them. But let me live in 2011, it's the rest of yu that need gtree bark for your RX. Just jump into your Volt and cruise on out to MM told you to get off your ass and go, loser.

"I stick around to try to help others not as fortunate as myself."

At 5:02 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...


YOUR WORDS "Anonymous.....DEAL !!"
Now you say you can't because of your concern for your fellow man? I don't recall a big wave of people crying out for a return to out house shitters
on the front page of news paper I've read in the past 50 years.
You re a lying scum bag! Or you would have gone a long time ago, two faced liberal liar. Put your money where the mouth full of fillings and crowns (I'm sure you could have gotten those in 1492)is!

At 6:40 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Anonymous, you asked...

"JG what was the average life expectancy of members of the Iroquois Confederacy before the Europeans?"

I honestly can't tell you, simply because I doubt that records such as this were kept back then. That's information derived through the gathering, compilation, and analyzing of data -- something that only "big government" would provide through the census -- which, by the way, is mandated by the United States Constitution.

But I'll tell you, with almost one-hundred percent certainty, that the native and indigenous people of North America ("Indians", in case you were scratching your head as to what that big word meant) experienced a longer life span than the Europeans that stole and occupied their land. So, comparing apples-to-apples, they lived a much healthier -- and longer -- life.

You weren't really serious when you were attempting to compare life expectancy rates of members of the Iroquois Confederacy in pre-colonial times to today, were you? I would hope not.

At 7:06 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

JG, I was as serious as EE and DD were about wanting to live like Native Americans did before 1492.
And look, shit for brains, don't try to pull that smarmy liberal I'm so smart and your so dumb crap on me!
You can go screw your self if think I'm going to let this bit of shit from your mouth pass without responding "("Indians", in case you were scratching your head as to what that big word meant)!
Drop dead you useless pile of European DNA. No one will miss you, no one.

At 8:18 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Anonymous, you said...

"Drop dead you useless pile of European DNA. No one will miss you, no one."

You would, Anonymous. You wouldn't have anybody to look up to...and admire. Which, really, isn't that the reason you hang out on this site?

Curiously, though, the intelligence and understanding that we possess hasn't rubbed off on you, and your comprehension skills haven't improved a bit. Is there something we're doing wrong? ;-) Or is Modusoperandi right about your stupefied state of uselessness? I'm starting to believe he's on to something.

At 8:34 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Test me, drop dead and see.

At 11:01 PM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

Testing.. Testing. test.

All is fine and well...until the commune gets busted...for smoking pot, having an abortion, homosexual marriages, pretty much anything the repubs don't like...or you want a resource that is on OUR land...then all of a sudden YOUR stupid views and stupid SMALL government is ALLLL over ours, sometimes small enough to fit into my tiny little uterus....

At 11:54 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Get a grip MM, read the posts between DD/EE and me and stop with the stupid knee jerk reaction.
No where did I promote conservative views, in fact I wished those two brain dead hippies all the luck in the world in their quest to find a place where they would be happy.
Just wanted them to leave me to live my life as I wanted to with out their telling me how wrong I was to do so.
In fact I used you as an example of someone who was going out to get what they wanted.

At 12:18 AM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

You don't get the point. I'm telling you that it never works. This country only lets those places exist within their social conforms. Yes, they are their own resources based economies, and they trade with the outside, but they are just a microcosm forced to live within the confines of another country's government and economy. Do you think the US would ever let those places sucede? No, and do you think those places would exist if they did, probably not, so they exist only as social experiments in the counter culture world. It is against corporate interests for the world to devolve back into these microcosms, so they go ignored, no matter how successful, harmonious, green, sustainable, and econ-feasible they are. So long as the hippy compound co-exists within the US, the hippy compound is subject to ALL US and STATE laws including that of the Free Market. You will constantly be an enemy of the corporatist state. This complicates things tremendously. A rumor can cause a raid at any time. Most of these people just want to live off the grid harmoniously, but these pigs can't have that, especially when there are valuable resources on the land that they are occupying. It's the Trail of Tears all over again, but smaller scale, and private companies instead of the government.

I'd never live in a compound, but I get why they do what they do, and I believe in de-evolving and the resource based economy.

At 12:29 AM, Blogger Mary Mayhem said...

Clarification - I believing in devolving economically... as in returning back to a resource based economy ...somewhat....However, I do not believe in devolving governmental authority....

Evolving and devolving have to increase and decrease in certain areas in order to balance out the universe...

At 9:30 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Do you think the US would ever let those places sucede,"
I don't know MM, they must be out there doing just fine. Maybe the problem is not enough people want to live that way?

At 9:42 AM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

The establishment cannot risk allowing non-capitalist alternative cultures to survive. If allowed to survive and prosper too many people will want to hop on that bus. Folks will discover that a simple life in tune with nature will benefit them more than the misguided approach greedy selfish capitalists are so fond of. That is why the establishment tries to suppress the " market place of free ideas ". It is afraid that on an even playing field its ideas will fail. They have to play dirty or they'll lose their game. People will realize there is a better way and it's not the establishment's way.

At 4:30 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...


Hey I thought you hated America as it is today and wanted to return to pre 1492, how come your still on the internet with your computer? Your bullshit about how you hated America now and how much better it was before the evil Europeans arrived was just that, pure dope addled dribble, cause you're still happy to use today's modern shit, aren't you?
You two faced pile of useless DNA, shut up if you cant walk the talk.

At 9:53 AM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

Anonymous....from now on I will use smoke signals only so keep an eye on the sky !!!

At 3:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

what kind of smoke, pot smoke or wood smoke?

At 4:22 PM, Blogger Ellis D., Esq. said...

At least you have a sense of humor !!! The odor of pot smoke would attract too much attention !!

At 8:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I wouldn't know.

At 10:08 PM, Blogger Jefferson's Guardian said...

Anonymous, you've never smoked -- ever? Where do you live? In a girls' school? ;-)

Or are you about twelve years old, like I've always suspected?

At 10:19 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

This author got the events right, but is still under the delusion that the left isn't working hand in glove with the right to bring about a totalitarian state. Progressivism is just the clueless toadies of the Party masters. The soviets used the term "useful idiots" to describe the pseudointellectuals that subsequently got 'purged' to Siberia. Get a clue.

At 11:05 PM, Anonymous Jay said...


A few things about the post:


"Privatization" is one of these genius marketing concepts that masks bad ideas sound good. Privatization suggests: competition, better services, better results, and opportunity. However, what it really stands for is: wage suppression, deregulation, union busting, and less government.

As you say: Keep voting Republican!

Armies of Hannitys

The conservative shock jocks are no longer pushing what we should believe, but merely suggesting it; much like a jingle. Where else can we see the likes of Alex Jones suggest--in the same broadcast--that the Moore, Oklahoma may--may have--been caused by "weather weapon stuff?" In the same broadcast, he makes the accusation that the US Army purposely caused a flood 15 years ago in Texas which killed 30 people.

We've got Rick Wiles giving radio broadcasts stating that Obama is Belazabub--The Lord of Flies--because flies have landed on him in the past.

These three alarming assertions are significant enough for National coverage...or at least a follow-up on the next day's show. But you'll never see that.

Daily these clowns pick a topic and toss their hand grenades into the drive time talk radio cycle. The topics are really meaningless. After all, if the President really was possessed by a demon, would anyone care about the budget or fucking immigration?

What is important is the constant message of despair and the more despair on the more topics the better.

The Stupid in This Country

Which brings us to the stupid of this country. Those that pay homage to Jones and Wiles and their ilk. Their names are usually "anonymous."

Only these dip-shits would turn into Wiles and "forget" that Obama was "possessed" by a demon and allow themselves to get riles up over a new topic.

I think on some level, the stupid even realize that these guys are full of shit. They just like being angry.



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